John Schlater II

Amazing...I love that stuff...that one shot when the girl was in te wheel chair and the room starts tweaking out...that reminded me a lot of "The Butterfly Effect" FX's. Very cool man! Very stimulating trailer I might add...makes you want more!!!! Your crew must be filled with Genius's!!!

I too am interested in learning more about this program...

Wow...I never knew those schools were so expensive. Personally...I think knowing the gear is way more importent than an expensive school. I don't really think it is worth that kind of money unless of course you got a scholarship or rich parents that are going to float the bill. I think if you are a good learner you can learn gear all by yourself but you would have to be very lucky to run into someone with expensive gear that is willing to teach you everything a school can teach you. I personally think you can learn to have a creative eye by reading up on style and creative outlook. There are a ton of books that target specific directors and thier style. I think the biggest thing is networking with fellow students. Lifetime friendships can be made in school. I think knowing the gear is key because if you know the gear...you can do what ever your little heart desires with it. School+Lots of Friends+Gear+Know How=a lot better chance than not going to school... LOL...Good luck.

I too have the same question. I am planning on purchasing the DVX 100B for the School District I work for and I want to make sure it will work out for what I need it for. I am usually shooting board meetings in Auditoriums/Cafeterias and special projects. I would like to know if it is suitable for "run and gun" style shooting. I have used many different DV cameras. I currently use the GL2 and it's NOT that great. It's fine for tripod shooting but for handheld...I hate it. It tends to be nose heavy. I like the Pana because lot of my friends in L.A., New York and Orlando are using it and coming across it in the real world quite a bit. I guess my idea was I wanted to follow suit with what is being used a lot by industry people. I have shot on a PD-150/170/2100 and I think they offer and excellent standard def. video picture. The PD150/170/2100 are great cameras but they too are nose heavy when shooting handheld. I would consider the XL2 but it is rather pricey and our school district doesn't need a "show boat" like that. I also am not a huge fan of the "wandering" focus problem I have ran across on the GL2, XL1 and the XL1S. I absolutely hate that fuzzy focus issue with those cameras...where they search for the focus in Auto mode. Shooting manual all the time isn't an option because the venues I shoot are always constantly changing. I also don't like that it is awkward to put on yur shoulder and also tends to be nose heavy. All the weight is in the front and not on the back of the camera. This...to me anyway... causes uneveness in handling the camera and puts a lot of weight on the right hand. Still a nice camera but not in our budget. I am a big fan of the ol' reliable PD100A we have. I think its great for "quick and drity" grab and go stuff. The main thing I don't like about that camera is that it ONLY records in 40 Min. DVCAM mode and is not switchable. Its small and powerful and...shoots in Progressive...which is a feature the newer PD10x version doesn't have. If you have any advice I am all ears. JB

I don't have a Pana 100B yet but I do shoot Direct to Hard Drive from a GL2...I use a NNovia Quik Capture. I think it works fine. We did have to send it in at one point to update the Firmware but I think it works very well. it saves me a lot of time by not neededing to swap tapes out after 60 minutes or capturing projects from tape. I can download clips quickly to the desktop, import them into Final Cut Pro and start editing right away. I think capturing Direct to HD is worth it weight in Gold.Final Cut warns me that the file type would need to be converted to a more useable form of DV through Media Manager but I never do and it still looks fine. Hope this helps. JB

I think the last three posts were really valuable. You all had some really good points. School gives you excellent networking ability. A LOT of Full Sail students that I went to school with are actually working in L.A. and New York. Some landed really cool jobs. I do envy them in that regard but...none of them...at least so far...aren't making the money I am making. Who's to say that they won't though? Not me. I think they are all very capable filmmakers and workers. They have the knowledge to support their work. Some DID give up. Like...they went to L.A....lived 5 people to a 2 bedroom and floundered in looking for work. They gave up...went back to mommy and daddys house and waited for something to hit them in the head. These are the types of ignorant people that expected their degrees to magically land them on a big Hollywood set or on Skywalker Ranch or something. School is what you make of it. I quite honestly had no outlet for film/video production in my city where I came from. I wasn't ever involved in video classes in high school or even my 1st college. I actually got a B.A. in Communication before I went to F.S. So I had one better on a lot of students. Most of all, I knew how to study. A lot of young F.S.r's didn't. I had no clue about how to set lighting or audio recording or film cameras or...pretty much anything that had to do with production. I had no clue but I wanted to know. I applied at a few local colleges for Film. Like the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee. They have an excellent experimental film program there but they only accept like 10 students a semester!!!! I was like...that is so stupid! They have this ideal there that "not all film students are created equal". Like...someone that is interested isn't good enough. They had to have actual film experience before they apply!!! Where was I going to get film experience BEFORE college in WI? No where. I wanted to GO to college to get experience!!! Duh. What is school for? To learn...to gain experience. For them to deny people on the basis of being underexperienced is ludicris. Seriously. Does that make any sense? So...I too checked out Emerson College in Boston and FSU in Florida and Columbia in Chicago and AFI in Calli and you know what? All of them had these extreme academic requirements for entry. None of which I had because lets face it...I was no A student in High School. I had ADD and learning for me was difficult...UNLESS it was something I was REALLY interested in. In this case...at FS...I rapidly accelerated in this school very quickly. The way they design the school was actually good for me in the end. Its an immersive environment. You are totally surrounded by gear almost every single day. We could touch it and work with it and when we had shoots...the shoots were designed around learning. The teachers didn't do anything for us...we did everything on our own. Like on a real film shoot. Landon...your right. At Full Sail...if you want to be a UPM or a 1st A.D. you better show that to your peers and teachers. Its a 50-50 thing. If you don't show the zeel for your chosen position...you won't land that job on the set. After all...to get the position on set...we had to apply for the position like a job. The teachers hired us for our positions. I was in the camera department all the time. I didn't want to know anything BUT camera. I DID on the other hand have a lot of experiences that allowed me to become more well rounded. In my present position...I am a "Jack Of All Trades". I learned a little bit of everything from F.S. and my fellow students too. In my real life job...I am satisifed with what I know. F.S. also taught that learning was not going to end when we graduated...that we should keep current on new technology and continue to learn from people as time goes on but also get ready to teach what we were taught too. For those of you that work regularly in this field...you know that you work with people everyday ...like the newbie P.A.'s...that you have to show them how to do stuff...so they also taught us to have patience with our peers! When they say Real World Education...they mean it. I am just now understanding this. I also have regrets that I was a trouble maker for that school at some points. I should've been much more forgiving to some people. It was hard at points and stress will sometimes turn you into some body that your not. Now let's talk about the price. This was the big thing for most people. I got an A.S. from there. I spent 26K on the degree program and 22K on living expenses. I am not sure of their B.A. program or its cost but I would never pay 60K for a B.A. from FS. They are known as a Tech school...their B.A.'s aren't going to be worth as much as some other B.A.'s I am very proud of my B.A in Comm. from the University of WI-Parkside in Kenosha, WI I got in 2000. Honestly...if you can get an A.S. in Film/Video I think that is the best thing. Its a technical field and naturally...a tech degree would be a very good choice. I agree with your arguement Landon...about buying equipment and making 4 feature films. Lets just say I did that and didn't go to school. I tell you the truth...from my viewpoint...I'd have a whole bunch of quality equipment but no idea how to use the stuff. At least by going to school I was able to gain a practial methodical approach to film/video production. And it really does show. When I go out to help people in the school district I work for...I REALLY know what I am doing. I blow people out of the water with how fast I can get things done and solve problems. Although I work in a school district...it would be the same thing for a production company or a film set. I get the job done quickly and efficently. Now instead of having 40K worth of equipment...I have a job that pays 50K a year and the ability in the future to move on to a even better job that pays even more AND I have the education to back me up. Lastly I would like to appoligize if I have irk'd anyone with my antics...its just that I get a little peeved when someone bashes FS like it is a POS school with nothing going for it...because that is the farthest thing from the truth. If somebody were to go to FS...and they were serious about their studying...they could actually be the next big thing IF the cards come up in their favor. Seriously...don't let the negitive hype that surrounds FS at times fool you...when your considering a school...I would say look at the equipment first...and try to go somewhere that has as new of equipment as possible because your not going to break into the film industry working on WWII Bell & Howell's.

Sorry if you didn't like my tone Grimmet. I was in the first class to use the Arri's at Full Sail and from what I remember as of August 2002 they weren't going to be using the Panavision anymore. Maybe that has changed...I dont' know myself. My appoligies if I irked you but the tone of the thread is anti Full Sail and that's cool...its a free world but my reaction to this thread is not positive. It's difficult not to come across as angry or hostile because that is after all my stance on the topic. I personally think my schooling from F.S. is what has earned me my present day succeses. Just because some of the students that went there didn't learn as much there as they think they should've doesn't mean its a bad school. Maybe they couldn't handle it...maybe it was overwhelming for them...I am not sure. I myself didn't like the way the school was run...I was very vocal about that. If you were to ask anybody that knew me while I was there they would tell you I was darn near close to leading the revolt at times. Now after its all over...as time goes on and more opprtunities arise around me... I find that I am more then well equipped with the technical knowledge of handling myself in today's technology ridden landscape. ...and here's one more little tid bit...for the last two jobs I got hired for...I got hired because I had F.S. on my resume. So...I don't know. Again I challenge the nay sayers to define their statements. In what way weren't they satisfied? Did they put forth enough effort into their studies? Did they seek out the instructors for help if they didn't understand something? Did they come in with questions on the open periods to use the equipment outside of class to learn more? I mean...there's a ton of questions here. I know a lot of students just went to class, went home...threw their books on the floor and grabbed a bottle of vodka and lit up a hooka. That was how many of the F.S. students thought studying got done. So...for those little children that didn't cherish the experience they had while they had it...thumbs down on them. You can't take any of them seriously. If they were unhappy, they had the option of dropping out and getting alot of their money back within the first 3 months but if they went all the way through with the course work... then its their own dang fault. They didnt' do enough to acheive. I did my share regardless of how the school was run. I know there are darn fine teachers there that actually care. Teachers that will actually come out and help you on a shoot of your own because they have no hold ups about production. A production is a production regardless of who's doing it. Hands down. When I walk into a building in my school district and the media people are looking for answers... I am the one that gives them what they need and I do a darn fine job at it. I'm not crying about not working for a big network or a studio or even a post house or production company. All I wanted were the skills to get a good job and do what I like... and that's helping people and working with video equipment. Full Sail has so much equipment that even a moron can learn somehting there. That moron just needs to put his/her nose to the grind stone and bust azz to learn on their free time and not be afraid to ask questions after class is over. That's how learning gets done.

Ha...I thought they stopped renting the PanaVision when they bought the Arri cameras. My class used the Arri's when they were brand new. No class ever used them before us. Did you go to FS or is that just what you heard? They stopped renting it like 4 years ago I thought. LOL...don't know where you got the info from. Maybe they give them the option of what camera to use now...I don't know...the Pana is almost a relic anyway. They haven't updated that camera since 1976 anyway... And I had fine teachers. I can tear them Arri cameras down and put them back together blind folded. I thought there were many fine teachers there...teachers that shouldn't be teaching...they should be in the industry somewhere doing a real job. When the Florida industry gets slow...some people in the field turn to FS for a job until the work picks back up. I had some of the best teachers there I have ever had. Don't get me wrong there was a few total idiots that got their teaching certificates from a cracker jack box. I seemed to learn just fine. The ones that didn't learn are the "zeros" in the back of the class riding into Full Sail on their mommy and daddy's dime. So many students thought they could go home and put their books and notebooks under their pillow at night to absorb information metaphysically. I get really sick of people bashing FS. I left there 4 years ago and today I am clearing 50K a year. So...what the heck did I do right that other dorks didn't? Maybe because I payed attention in general and took notes. The younger students got bogged down so easily by all the little things like not having someone wipe their azz for them after they took a poopie. I love how people cry about how the school didn't get them a job after they graduated. All they do is complain and then when they don't get a job after graduation...they blame FS for not teaching them anything. Don't get me wrong...FS specializes in smoke and mirrors. They pitch a real hard sell. Lots of their past graduates have gone on to work in high profile jobs...but many just go back to their po-dunk azz town and wait for the golden job to come flying through their bedroom window and land in there lap. NEWSFLASH: IT AIN"T GOING TO HAPPEN!!!! ...what I love even more is when people say the school sucks and they never really went there to visit or check it out...that's ultimately my favorite anti-FS stance...when people on the other side of the country bash a school they have never had the pleasure of setting a foot in. Or other school grads that think their school was way better than FS because they went to SoCal or FSU...too bad those schools don't have half the equipment FS does. LOL...many traditional 4 year schools are still teaching on WWII Bell and Howell's...and an Avid is a pipe dream away...LOL...Full Sail taught 3 different versions of Avid. Full Sail teaches the gear...its up to the student as to what he/she does with it. I know the gear...and I know it well. If you are naturally a tech savvy person...FS can give you the Technical edge you need to get into the industry in some regard...but just because you don't end up working for Lucas or Tarantino doesn't mean the school is to blame...its the individual that defines themself as a professional and takes the bull by the horns and gets a job they can really do and learn and grow in. Some people shoot too high...why go to L.A. and be a small fish in a big pond with no experience. Try the big fish in a small pond approach and you will get much farther. Look into some community TV stations, Post houses, Colleges or something that will give some good first experience and then make the big move when the time presents itself. Too many dreamers are expecting to start working on the next big thing and they get severely let down instead. Then they give up altogether and blame FS for everything...if they didn't make it...it was because they were unmotivated and lazy. Lets face it...there is at least one job out there that can be had if they try hard enough to get. Evetually they will land something that could act as a spring board for the future.

When I first wrote this thread my idea was that it was an ideal thread to just flat out talk about any and all experiences with any camera you all have used or came into contact with. After 5 pages I got all of what I asked for and more...keep up the good conversation everyone...I am impressed with your depth of knowledge! Thank you very much! There are so many to choose from...how can I make up my mind!!! I still have been looking at the Canon 814/1014...very nice camera for not a heck of a lot... I also saw a Super Elmo on Bay today along with a very nice looking Nikon R10. There were a handful of nce S8's on ebay...made me drool a little bit...just a ittle... Not many Beaulieu's but I think I saw a Leicina but I don't know if it was one fo the better ones... What are some of your favorite lenses? Favorite modifications??? JSII

Check out Emerson College in Boston, MA Awesome school for Doc work... Good luck. JSII

That could be Ashley...I PM'd you about that... Yeah...that's how I feel about people that bash FS and have never gone there or even visited the school. I went tot hat FSSucks website and read all the posts when it exsisted and the truth of the matter is that the guyt that started that website was found out to be connected to ta school in Arizona called UAT...and then Full Sail sued the kid...and WIPO denied FS because it was noted as a legitimate complaint website... Read about it here... http://arbiter.wipo.int/domains/decisions/...d2003-0502.html Here's the legal juicy details found at the end... "We conclude, based on the evidence before us, that the Complainant has failed to meet its burden of proving bad faith registration and use. The website appears to be a legitimate protest site, used to inform current and potential students about Complainant?s school. The website primarily contains negative and positive reviews and opinions about the school, ostensibly from current or former students. The site does not appear to be commercial in nature since it does not offer or propose the sale of any goods or services to visitors of the site. Although Complainant alleges that Respondent is using the website for the express purpose of diverting prospective and current students to a competing enterprise for commercial gain, there is insufficient evidence on the record before the Panel to support such a conclusion. There is no indication here that the Domain Name was registered and used with the intent to sell the Domain Name for profit. Similarly, there is no indication that the Registrant engages in a pattern of unfair conduct to prevent others registering domain names that correspond to their trademarks. Complainant argues that the site is commercial in effect because it discourages persons from using Complainant?s services. That, however, is not sufficient to constitute bad faith use for the reasons noted in the Taubman decision. Such criticism is allowed under U.S. law and therefore is not a basis alone for finding bad faith use. Complainant contends that the Domain Name should be considered bad faith use because it seems to be connected with a competitive school. While a competitor?s use of a Domain Name for a site to disparage a competitor might be viewed as bad faith commercial use, Complainant has failed to prove that the Domain Name is registered and used by a competitor to disrupt Complainant?s business. Although Respondent seems evasive on this point and has not fully explained his intent in operating the site, there is insufficient evidence to find for Complainant on this point. Finally, the fact that Respondent has succeeded in obtaining a prominent position in search engine results does not provide an independent basis for a finding of bad faith. In summary, the evidence indicates that the Domain Name is used for a non-commercial commentary about Complainant?s business, and the allegations of bad faith are not supported by sufficient evidence to support a finding in Complainant?s favor on bad faith. In reaching, this conclusion we again note that our inquiry is limited in scope and is based on a limited record. 7. Decision For all the foregoing reasons, the Complaint is denied." Now I don't know if that Ryan guy ever went to Full Sail or if it was becasue he worked for a school in Arizona called UAT...either way...the kid didn't graduate from there so...maybe he was one of the drop outs that couldn't hack it... Like I said...I thought it was worth it in the end...as long as you don't go in there thinking your gonna be working with George Lucas when you graduate...you will learn far more than you ever dreamed of. Its the most technilogically immersive school for film and a lot of other media related things...you will be surrounded by technology from day one and if you can't learn anything from there...then you either didn't try...are a rich kid moron or you were too partied out to go to class...its impossible not to learn something from that school...

I just read this thread and just wanted to reply to it... I went to Full Sail. I graduated in the Nov. 2002 class. The hours were long and the cirriculum was hard. I was in class at 1AM to 5AM and 5AM to 9AM and 9AM to 1PM and 1PM to 5PM and 5PM to 9PM and 9PM to 1AM....and I went to class on Sat and Sun. I worked with the best gear possible...brand new 2002 versions of the Arri 35mm Studio Cam and Lite. I worked on a Quantel Edit box and editied on 5 different editing platforms incluing 3 versions of Avid...I used so many diffeerent pieces of equipment it was even funny and it is one of the best schools for media production out there. Now that I said as much as I could poistive about it...let me talk about its downfalls... A lot of what was said already is true but only to a certian extent. Full Sail is a business...just like all the movies and songs that were ever made or written. Full Saill will gladly find you a financial provider...so yeah...they didn't start the school to stay broke and teach kids about this stuff for free. I took every drop of money I could get and I left with a huge bill. I was pretty broke for the first year working at some dumb azz kids museum for 24K a year but at least I got a job. Let me tell you all something...you won't go up into Full Sail and get straight A's...your gonna have to work at it and work at it hard because it IS hard and the flunk out rate in the first 3 month is high. They didn't just hand us over a diploma and that was it...we had to bust our freakin tails to make it. Think of it as Film School Boot Camp. It will haze you...it will violate you...you will feel frustrated...its a lot like real life...get used to it...and stop crying like a momma's boy or a daddy's girl... I didn't have anybody paying my way....I took it on my own shoulders to go into that school and come out wth the tools I needed to make it. I laugh at all the kids that went to FS and thought that the placement department was gonna be handing out "golden job tickets" in each diploma on graduation day. The placement department was loaded with a bunch of desk jockeys...I can tell you that...but it has since recieved a huge revamp in organization and has gotten quite a bit better. For the record...I was a ringleader when I went to that school. I walked around bad mouthing that place left and right because I was upset about certian things. Like when I started attending...we were supposed to be learning on a PanaVision but they decided to purchase brand new Arri's instead of continuing to pay permenant rental fees on the Pana. That made me mad...but in the end...the Arri's were ncier cameras any way. I was also significantly upset about the price of the school in the end...but you know what...their operating costs are WAY higher than any of us can expect. For the record... I do think the owner is a shister anyway. In the end...let me tell you one concrete fact. Any of you can go to an Ivy League privite school or any top rated film school throughout the country. The cost of those schools with living expenses will be far more out of control than my FS bill and you still won't know jack when you leave. There aren't many film schools that teach 16mm and 35mm in the same year...a lot of you would be lucky to touch 16mm. You will most likely be studying about film style and technique...you won't be building full blown studio sets and working with HMI's or Kino Flo's or any piece of equiment that says Mole Richardson on it. You won't all be writing scripts or get to actually direct in directing class...you definately won't be working on a Quantel EditBox...and you won't be making 45K only 2 years after graduation...that you really aren't gonna be doing.... If you want to go to FS...expect to work and work hard and learn alot...don't go up in there and expect to sit around and be lazy and be handed a job on the ay out. I checked out every film school in the midwest before I decided to go there and it was the right choice for me because I made it. I might not be working in Hollywood or New York but I know what the gear is and I know how to use it. You can learn about Francis Ford Coppola and Speilberg all you want...but if you don't know what an Arri 35mm camers does when you pick it up...you'll never work on it. If you don't know how to edit with the newest NLE system...you won't work on it...put it this way...you can read all the books you want...but if you don't know gear...you won't work in the industry...at all. You'll be a doughnut boy/girl...and cryin' about how your school didn't hook you up with a job after you were finished. Lastly...and this is on a personal note...if your parents are rich but you are dumb and want to go to Full Sail...I wouldn't go there if I was you. There are poor kids that have been broke all there lives that will know more than you because they took all the free lessons they could get...they weren't given their life on a golden platter...they struggled and strived to learn every ounce of knowledge they could muster...while the rich kids struggled because they flat out weren't smart enough. Money can't buy everything. I know a kid who's daddy bought him enough equipment to fill a small sound stage and an 80,000 dollar Avid and in the end...he had a bunch of equipment he barely could use. If any of you understand where I am coming from... cool...but for those of you that don't...you never will... JSII (EDIT: The forum wouldn't let me reedit my post so I am reediting my post and deleteing the previous one.) Joseph... You are right...but my point is that its about the student and what that student does to make it. Don't blame a school that you choose to go to...I did and I regret it because I could've left there with more teachers as friends...even though some of them werent worth the shoes they stand in. I have seen the Anti FS stuff for such a long time and it makes me mad as H-LL because it for some reason makes me feel bad for going there...and I don't feel bad. I feel good. I work in a cool enviornment...I work in a field that every body envys. I got to do projects and meet with people while other people ride desks, answer phones or sell socks to people. I seen the director of my 35mm class project working at Subway a month after graduating...I was riding a 35mm Arri for a side project that day and I stopped in there for lunch...go figure...its all about the student.

Alex...where did you get all those beautiful accessories?!!! I have a friend that I think just bought that same camera and I would love to give him the info as to where he can collect all those fine pieces!!! Spill the beans!!! Hey everyone...I am so glad to see this thread is still alive and that a Newbie can start a nice long discussion...thanks for all the replys I will read them all when I get home tonight... Sorry I haven't been back for a while. I was working on a short informational/documentary type video for the school district I work for. It monopolized my life for like 3 months. Here's the results of my efforts... http://www.kusd.edu/referendum/video/room/ref_05_video.html (I am not real crazy about what streaming software our district uses but I have no control of that...sorry.) If you you all want to watch the whole thing...be my guest but beware its 20 minutes long...let meknow what you think of it please... I shot 4-5 hours of raw footage on a GL2 and a Sony PD100A...edited down to 20 minutes. Editied on a Dual 2.7GHz G5 in Final Cut HD, graphics done in Adobe After Effects, Voice over was done at a local recording studio in town here called Renwood Messenger. Done all in house except for graphics...I asked a friend of mine for a personal favor and he donated them to the cause...very swell of him I thought...but I known him since I was 7 years old...so...its a favor I could ask. Anyway...keep up the good conversation and I will chat with you all soon. John

Oh...nice to see there are zealots in every crowd...you picked the right guy to argue with... Uh yeah thanks a lot. I didn't notice the JVC specific section at first. If you don't have anything nice to say then don't say anything at all. If you want to flame me...go ahead but be warned...I only had a small question and was hoping we could start a conversation about it...but if there are so many here that are too good or are better than me... then don't bother...because I won't stand for someone "trying" to put themselves on a pedestal over other people regardless of the medium. So often I run into know-it-alls on the internet...and I have to remind them that they were snot nosed little kids at one point in life... and from some of the replies...I guess they are now snot nosed adults too. So for those of you that had something good to say thanks a lot...but to those of you that had negitive things to say...go take that holier-than-thou attitiude you tout around on the tip of your nose that you turn up at people and go screw yourself....and don't ever reply to any of my posts ever again because I will remember you and I will call you out for being a pompus Ahole for now on...regardless of your experience or expertise for its not what you say that defines you...its your actions that speak louder than words and your shown your true colors to me right away...so unfortuneately...you both are turd in my books. Now you two can go cuddle underneath the rocks you were under...slugs.

Did any of you see this yet? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller...egoryNavigation Wow...I don't even know what to say about it...just wow...what rock has JVC been hiding under... :blink: