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Reservation timing to delivery


Patrizio De Sica
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If I will have a reservation now when will it be in my hands?

 

RED is not promising a firm delivery date yet. They are targeting Q2 of 2007 for the first production units, but that's just a target at this point. Your delivery will also be subject to your place in the queue.

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I'm no RED shill, but I wouldn't bet against them.

 

Greg,

 

I would bet that the chip won't be able to handle 15 stops over Key!. The best I have seen with my own eyed on a Video camera is + 5 with the Thopmson Viper.

 

I heard the 15 stop claim before I saw the footage, that may account for some of my dissapointment.

 

Stephen

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Stephen,

 

We officially claim >66db. That's it. Some who left the theater (and some in Hollywood) said 12-15 stops, which we have not measured. You saw the footage. What was your assessment of the Porsche shot? I assume you saw the footage at IBC.

 

We will post that shot next week (only debayered .tiff) so everyone can take a swing at their opinion of the dynamic range. But I'd love to hear your opinion before we post it. You get to be the expert for a week. And your opinion will be scrutinized when the image is released.

 

Jim

Edited by Jim Jannard
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Greg,

 

I would bet that the chip won't be able to handle 15 stops over Key!. The best I have seen with my own eyed on a Video camera is + 5 with the Thopmson Viper.

 

I heard the 15 stop claim before I saw the footage, that may account for some of my dissapointment.

 

Stephen

 

Stephen,

 

I won't take THAT particular bet, but the camera doesn't have to perform to that spec to be a useful tool.

 

Greg

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Stephen,

 

We officially claim >66db. That's it. Some who left the theater (and some in Hollywood) said 12-15 stops, which we have not measured. You saw the footage. What was your assessment of the Porsche shot? I assume you saw the footage at IBC.

 

We will post that shot next week (only debayered .tiff) so everyone can take a swing at their opinion of the dynamic range. But I'd love to hear your opinion before we post it. You get to be the expert for a week. And your opinion will be scrutinized when the image is released.

 

Jim

 

Hi Jim,

 

I wasn't on the set with a spot meter so it's impossible for me to say! I am more interested in testing and reaching the correct answer!

 

I would like to see a grey scale exposed from +8 stops to -8 stops in 1 stop intervals. Happy to fly over and do the tests myself if you want!

 

If your sensor is +/- 6 stops, then it's better than the Viper. It may or may not be.

 

How does showing a debayered .till help to establish how many stops the chip can handle?

 

Stephen

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"I heard the 15 stop claim before I saw the footage, that may account for some of my dissapointment."

 

Sounds like you were disappointed with the footage. That means you saw it. That means you were at IBC. That means you had an opinion of it relative to the Porsche shot. We all want to hear what your opinion was.

 

Those that had an opinion did see the Porsche shot.

 

Jim

Edited by Jim Jannard
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I wouldnt get my hopes up of having it in your hands.

So, y'know, it's gonna suck when RED comes out and instead of Mr. Jannard posting on the forum, "hey thanks for the support, the feedback, it really helped us reach our goal" he posts, "Eff you guys, look, we did it, and furthermore, you guys suck at predicting things." Anyway, even if you think the camera never will come out, it makes no sense to broadcast that opinion.

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"I heard the 15 stop claim before I saw the footage, that may account for some of my dissapointment."

 

Sounds like you were disappointed with the footage. That means you saw it. That means you were at IBC. That means you had an opinion of it relative to the Porsche shot. We all want to hear what your opinion was.

 

Those that had an opinion did see the Porsche shot.

 

Jim

 

Hi Jim,

 

We met and exchanged business cards, you know I was as IBC! I also exchanged business cards with Graeme in the theatre.

 

I saw the Porsche but was unable to confirm that your sensor has any more dynamic range than other sensors available today.

 

When can I have a Red Camera to test?

 

Stephen

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Stephen. I am sorry. I don't remember all the people I met at IBC by name. But you are stating things that seem derogatory to the RED program whether you mean to or not. The dynamic range will be confirmed as soon as we get back home and do more testing. If you are unwilling to take a stab at what you saw in the Porsche shot... that's OK. We'll post it to show the tremendous lattitude of our sensor. To include a 4k Arri light IN the shot was pretty brave IMHO. The way our sensor handled it was applauded by all. Including many who have major film credits. At the end of the day, you can look at numbers (which we have quoted as >66 db) or you can look at the footage.

 

Jim

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Stephen. I am sorry. I don't remember all the people I met at IBC by name. But you are stating things that seem derogatory to the RED program whether you mean to or not. The dynamic range will be confirmed as soon as we get back home and do more testing. If you are unwilling to take a stab at what you saw in the Porsche shot... that's OK. We'll post it to show the tremendous lattitude of our sensor. To include a 4k Arri light IN the shot was pretty brave IMHO. The way our sensor handled it was applauded by all. Including many who have major film credits. At the end of the day, you can look at numbers (which we have quoted as >66 db) or you can look at the footage.

 

Jim

 

Jim,

 

I am in no way being derogatory, when can we do a test and get an answer?

 

What was the range of the projector?

 

Stephen

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Stephen... yes, the answer to David's question. I wish you would answer the questions I ask as directly as I answer the ones you ask.

 

Jim

 

Jim,

 

My Opinion on the Porsche shot: I could not tell if the sensor had 15 stops of latitude. FWIW I prefered the Cigar shot.

 

When can I test a camera?

 

Stephen

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It seems slightly ludicrous that you continually ask to test a camera that the developers are still tweaking with

 

 

Hi,

 

Jim has not answered the question, I am happy to test the camera in developement. I would have tested it at IBC if it had been there!

 

Stephen

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I answered the question. You did not.

 

"I heard the 15 stop claim before I saw the footage, that may account for some of my dissapointment."

 

You saw the Porsche shot. You heard the 12-15 stops from the exiting viewers. What did you see that was a dissapointment? Exactly?

 

I'm going to post that shot. You are the critic. Here is your chance to to say what you saw before I post it.

 

Jim

Edited by Jim Jannard
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I answered the question. You did not.

 

"I heard the 15 stop claim before I saw the footage, that may account for some of my dissapointment."

 

You saw the Porsche shot. You heard the 12-15 stops from the exiting viewers. What did you see that was a dissapointment? Exactly?

 

I'm going to post that shot. You are the critic. Here is your chance to to say what you saw before I post it.

 

Jim

 

Jim,

 

I don't think you have answered my question. I will repeat it " When can I test your camera" you can watch!

 

I5 stops is a contrast ratio of in excess of 64,000 : 1. I don't think your sensor is that good. I hope to be proved wrong. A simple test with a Grey scale will establish in under 1 hour.

 

Stephen

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OK, Stephen. You can't test our sensor. That's my answer. Only because you wouldn't answer my question. "What did you see that was a dissapointment?" When you posted that comment, it gave the impression that something was wrong with the dynamic range. I don't think you meant that, but that is the impression you gave. That shot has baffled many in the industry. How it could elegantly handle a 4k light IN the shot and show incredible gradation on the 959, show detail in the shadows INCLUDING the orange power cord which was not lit at all.

 

Had you said you were amazed (as all the other people who saw it), I would have flown you out to test our sensor, on my dime. Too late. :-)

 

Jim

Edited by Jim Jannard
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OK, Stephen. You can't test our sensor. That's my answer. Only because you wouldn't answer my question. "What did you see that was a dissapointment?" When you posted that comment, it gave the impression that something was wrong with the dynamic range. I don't think you meant that, but that is the impression you gave. That shot has baffled many in the industry. How it could elegantly handle a 4k light IN the shot and show incredible gradation on the 959, show detail in the shadows INCLUDING the orange power cord which was not lit at all.

 

Had you said you were amazed (as all the other people who saw it), I would have flown you out to test our sensor. Too late. :-)

 

Jim

 

Jim,

 

I don't think there is anything wrong with the Dynamic range of the Red sensor. I usually shoot on 35mm as I am often disappointed with digital cinematography.

Hopefully you can shoot a Grey scale at 1 stop intervals +/- 8 stops (more if its worth it) and post the results.

 

Stephen

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