cement vs Kodak Presstape splice

Jack Honeycutt · July 31, 2004

Folks...

I don't want to start a "which splice is best" war. Just a application question.

I am working mostly with moving a lot of 8 mm (probably Kodachrome II) shot in the 1960s and 1970s to DVD. I hand clean & lub with Ecco VSF 299, then move it to a Workprinter where I digitize it. Then I clean & lub it one more time, then put it away. I find bad sprockets, broken and bad splices. This film will probably be projected again very little, if ever.

For my application, will the Kodak Presstape splice work fine? Or should I buy a cement splicer?

Thanks

jack

Alessandro Machi · July 31, 2004

I was visiting a rank transfer facility and the 16mm film that was being transfered kept coming apart at the cement splices. The kicker was the cement splices were made at an angle, (perhaps 45 degrees?).

Tape splices come apart also, however my preference is tape. For my purposes, I use the 4 frame splice tabs versus the two frame because the splices are merely to link up two pieces of unedited film. Probably for already edited films you would go with the two frame splice if you choose tape.

harryprayiv · July 31, 2004

You might also consider that most transfer facilities won't accept films with tape splices...they just won't. Cement is definitely better IMO, but it CAN and DOES come apart at the splice. My experience is that cement is actually stronger unless it is old cement. Also, the splices look better with cement and will run through projection equipment much, much more smoothly.

Alessandro Machi · July 31, 2004

I don't agree that most transfer houses don't accept tape splices. If it has to do with the film transfer "bumping" at the tape splices and the transfer house not wanting to be held responsible, that I can agree with.

Dwaynes sends their processed film back with tape spliced leader.

harryprayiv · August 1, 2004

I don't agree that most transfer houses don't accept tape splices. If it has to do with the film transfer "bumping" at the tape splices and the transfer house not wanting to be held responsible, that I can agree with.

Dwaynes sends their processed film back with tape spliced leader.

sorry to misinform anyone. That is what my teacher said and perhaps I should have researched it before I opened my fat mouth.

August 1, 2004

I only used cement splices on my school films. None of the splices ever came apart. The tape makes the image unsharp but it may fix, a little, a damaged sprocket.

Pete

harryprayiv · August 1, 2004

I only used cement splices on my school films. None of the splices ever came apart. The tape makes the image unsharp but it may fix, a little, a damaged sprocket.

Pete

Yeah. I was referring to how well it adheres when it is old. I had used some of my school's professional film cement and even though my splices were as clean and precise as most negative cutters' work, they came apart in the projector at every single splice. It was my final too! I had to buy my own cement and re-splice every single one, losing a frame on both sides of the splice. It was terrible.

August 1, 2004

That's interesting. I must have used a better cement. Mine never came apart. Pete

Alessandro Machi · August 1, 2004

I only used cement splices on my school films. None of the splices ever came apart. The tape makes the image unsharp but it may fix, a little, a damaged sprocket.

Pete

Yeah. I was referring to how well it adheres when it is old. I had used some of my school's professional film cement and even though my splices were as clean and precise as most negative cutters' work, they came apart in the projector at every single splice. It was my final too! I had to buy my own cement and re-splice every single one, losing a frame on both sides of the splice. It was terrible.

Yeah, I just watched a film do that during a rank transfer. The film was a 16mm print probably from the early 70's. They were cement splices cut at a 45% angle. The colorist was not to happy about it.

Tim Carroll · August 2, 2004

I've got one of those old Bolex cement splicers and that thing is fantastic. Get some fresh cement from Kodak and have at it. I've used it on regular 8mm and Super 8mm and have never had a problem with either. Very strong, very clean. I've never been a huge fan of the tape splicers, although the last time I used one was back in the 70's.

-Tim

harryprayiv · August 2, 2004

I've got one of those old Bolex cement splicers and that thing is fantastic. Get some fresh cement from Kodak and have at it. I've used it on regular 8mm and Super 8mm and have never had a problem with either. Very strong, very clean. I've never been a huge fan of the tape splicers, although the last time I used one was back in the 70's.

-Tim

Yeah. I was using the Bolex for these particular splices, although I like using the hot splicer at school much better. You can be sure it has adhered with the hot splicer. The Bolex thing involves scraping the emulsion away to get to the base and then doing the same on the other side. You lose one frame from it, but it's usually VERY clean if you're using a cotton swab.

I have learned my lesson about old cement though. I have developed some rules for future film work though.

- always buy you're own

- close the cement container at every available moment

- clean the splicer/splices/area around the splices often

- work quickly

I'd say, despite being finicky, cement splices are considered the most archival and solid because they bond two layers of base together instead of adding some glue and plastic on the film. This has been my take on tape vs. cement splices.

ps. I used to get good results with Wurker splices (and burnishing the splice with a hard object on the splice seam to) until I realized that cement is much, much better.

John Pytlak RIP · August 4, 2004

The issue with tape splices is that solvent cleaning may dissolve the tape adhesive.

Matt Pacini · August 6, 2004

If you want permanent splices, use cement.

If you're going to tape them, use Hervic tape.

It only covers one frame on each side of the cut, whereas the Kodak tapes cover two frames, so they're very visible.

But any tape splices are going to get brittle and break eventually, and given the fact that Kodachrome will store for something like 100 years (try THAT with video!), those tapes are gonna give your great-grandchildren a nightmare!

Matt Pacini