Hank Parker Posted October 5, 2004 Share Posted October 5, 2004 What are the advantages of getting a matte box with french flags for a panasonic dvx100a? What is the purpose of the matte box? The french flag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alvin Pingol Posted October 5, 2004 Share Posted October 5, 2004 Mattebox: Good for quick, easy filter swapping. Instead of screwing in and out round filters, you simply slide a square filter into place. French flag: Good for eliminating lens flares from out-of-frame light sources. E.g., you're outside and the sun is overhead, at a bit of an angle so as to create a nasty flare, position the flag so that it casts a shadow over the lens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Parker Posted October 5, 2004 Author Share Posted October 5, 2004 Thanks alvin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted October 5, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted October 5, 2004 Hi, I took the french flag off my mattebox; it always seemed like a DV kiddie's accessory and I've only ever had to slip it back on (three screws, half a turn each) once. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Greg Gross Posted October 8, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted October 8, 2004 Used French flag shooting at the atlantic coast(very high contrast daytime). Served its purpose very well, I used them on my PD170 with screw on filters when I could not use lens hood(polarizer). Greg Gross, Professional Photographer Student cinematographer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Mark Sasahara Posted October 9, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted October 9, 2004 I find the matte box and french flag to be very useful and use them almost all the time. For some filters I use, like the Black Pro Mist, the french flag and side wings are a must to prevent the filter from flaring. I like the french flag, also known as an eyebrow, since it helps keep the flare from overhead illumination down. It also acts as a kind of fold down lens cap, between takes, when moving the camera, etc. When shooting in foul weather, the eyebrow can help keep water and snow off the lens. Having a matte box with rotating stages is also nice for polarizers and graduated filters. As with anything, it's best to do some research, check out books and Google matte boxes. Note that there are several ways to spell it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest vic73 Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Doesn't the polorizer do the same job as the flag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew McDermott Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 The polarizer and french flag do different things. The polarizer is effecting the light that actually enters the lens, while the french flag is preventing light from striking the filter or lens and causing haze or flare on the image. What is lacking from most matteboxes designed for DV cameras is a sidewing system. Often times it's useful to be able to control stray light entering from the side of the frame as well as the top. I've got a clip on flag on an arm to help here but sidewings would be nice. If you're buying new, I think Chrosziel's got a new one designed for the DVX that has them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Salzmann Posted October 13, 2004 Share Posted October 13, 2004 Sidewings are nice but every camera assistant I have ever worked with has a piece of Cinefoil with them and that works just fine. If it's a locked down shot, a small flag will do it. Even after years in the business it still amazes me how expensive matte boxes are. Why don't the Chinese start knocking out some matteboxes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted October 13, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted October 13, 2004 Hi, Cinefoil. Whatever next? Cinesaran-wrap? Cinetakeboardmarker? Cineunderpants? Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason McKelvey Posted October 13, 2004 Share Posted October 13, 2004 If you're building somethings on-set, you'll need a cinesaw. sorry. J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Salzmann Posted October 13, 2004 Share Posted October 13, 2004 Cinefoil is another brand of Blackwrap here in Europe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alvin Pingol Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 Whatever next? Cinesaran-wrap? Cinetakeboardmarker? Cineunderpants?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Cinetable. Specially designed for the craft service. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Michael Nash Posted October 17, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted October 17, 2004 You all need a kick in the cinesaddle. :P Let's not get started on the Pana-everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Gross Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 Why don't the Chinese start knocking out some matteboxes? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> They do. Check out the products from CAVISION. Sold from Canada but manufactured in China. Kinda junky cheap plastic as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Salzmann Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 I've looked at CAVISION matteboxes and they do look very plastic and junky. According to sound people that I know and work with, the Chinese are knocking off very good copies of Neumann microphones for less than 1/3 of the price. This is high precision machining. I'd like to know why someone isn't making high quality matteboxes that are more reasonably priced than Chrosziel stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vivian Zetetick Posted October 18, 2004 Share Posted October 18, 2004 I just shot a short film outdoors using a DVX100a outfitted with the Chrosziel Matte Box system. I didn't use side wings, and had the .7x wide angle adapter on most of the time. I've been logging the 6+ hours of footage and have yet to see a lens flare. I'm glad I didn't spend the extra $600 for them. Be careful of cheaper matte box systems if you plan on using the wide angle or anamorphic adapters -- they may vignette the frame. The Chrosziel system does not vignette. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted October 18, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted October 18, 2004 Hi, I'm not sure that has as much to do with the cost as it does to simply how wide the mattebox is formed. There's very wide very cheap ones which may be as crappy! Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWilliamPatrickB Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 Hi, I took the french flag off my mattebox; it always seemed like a DV kiddie's accessory and I've only ever had to slip it back on (three screws, half a turn each) once. Phil <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Sorry guys but a French flag has nothing to do with a matte box the Eyebrow or Menardis is whats attached to a Mattebox. The French flag is held by an independant arm and is very maneuverable around the front and sides of the box eyebrow, manardis or plane lens. GWPB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Gross Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 Sorry guys but a French flag has nothing to do with a matte box the Eyebrow or Menardis is whats attached to a Mattebox. The French flag is held by an independant arm and is very maneuverable around the front and sides of the box eyebrow, manardis or plane lens. GWPB <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The standard reference for a French Flag is a small card on an orticulating arm that attaches to the camera and can be positioned to stop stray light from hitting the lens. The flap which attaches to the top of the mattebox is generally referred to as an eyebrow. However, it is also called by many a French Flag, expanding the definition of the term. Chrosziel, for one, calls their eyebrow a French Flag and it is listed that way in their catalog and labelled as such on the item itself (says it right on mine). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWilliamPatrickB Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 The standard reference for a French Flag is a small card on an orticulating arm that attaches to the camera and can be positioned to stop stray light from hitting the lens. The flap which attaches to the top of the mattebox is generally referred to as an eyebrow. However, it is also called by many a French Flag, expanding the definition of the term. Chrosziel, for one, calls their eyebrow a French Flag and it is listed that way in their catalog and labelled as such on the item itself (says it right on mine). <{POST_SNAPBACK}> OK just because the word AINT is in some dictionaries is no reason to use it! Just because Chroisel is trying to change the accepted definition (accepted in the USA) is no reason to use it. The larger picture is, our profession has set standards and definitions and meanings for certain pieces of equipment. The fact that a piece of equipment is defined (translated) from a cataloge as being something else is no reason to start using it here. The precision with which we work and the definitions we use are for clairity and over the last 100 years or so have come to be rather specific. Thats how doctors from one side of the country can speak to the other side with clairity. The same holds true for us DP's, Assistants,, Loaders, Rental Houses we comunicate with etc. So after having been doing this for over28 years I cant think of one American rental house or asst. I have worked with that in actuality calls a French Flag an Eyebrow or the other way around. Thats why they have two different names. GWPB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Salzmann Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 I second GWPB on this! An eyebrow and a French flag are 2 different things. With what Chrosziel charges for their products they can afford to get this right and their marketing people should have talked to some pros about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Gross Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Ya'll gotta relax a bit. Language is an ever-evolving thing and even a specific jargon-enhanced industry such as our own can continually change. Contrary to you I know plenty of longtime professionals who occassionally refer to mattebox eyebrows as French Flags and the walls of Jericho have not come tumbling down. There's plenty of crosstalk in this industry. There are plenty of terms that differ simply between New York and LA. What were "Gary Coleman" and "Emmanuel Lewis" stands referred to as before these two individuals became celebrities? And how many terms are there for "Obie" lights? I know of at least three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted October 20, 2004 Premium Member Share Posted October 20, 2004 Hi, When I bought it, I said "eesh, I'll probably take this bit off." Sales person said "Oh, I don't know, a french flag is quite handy." Therefore I assumed.... Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riku Naskali Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Any tips for building my own mattebox? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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