Dumb HD Question

[Guest Frank Gossimier]

Ok here's a dumb HD question for you.

 

Is HD, HD, all over the world? Or is there NTSC HD and PAL HD?

 

If there is a difference what are they?

 

The new HDV format, is that universal? Or PAL and NTSC specific?

 

Thanks

Frank

[Mike Brennan]

Ok here's a dumb HD question for you.

 

Is HD, HD, all over the world?  Or is there NTSC HD and PAL HD?

 

If there is a difference what are they?

 

The new HDV format, is that universal? Or PAL and NTSC specific?

 

Thanks

Frank

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

To simplify

 

Actual size of the frame in pixels is the same. But the frame rate on most HD cameras and decks is selectable to match NTSC, (59.97 fields per second) PAL (50 fields per second) or cinema release (24 frames per second).

 

Note that there are some cameras that have limited frame rates. Beware!

 

Mike Brennan

[Stephen Williams]

[is HD, HD, all over the world? Or is there NTSC HD and PAL HD?

 

If there is a difference what are they?

 

The new HDV format, is that universal? Or PAL and NTSC specific?

 

Thanks

Frank

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Greetings,

 

NTSC HD is 30p or 60i

 

PAL HD is 25p or 50i

 

The new HDV is region specific.

 

Stephen Williams DoP

[David Mullen ASC]

I think it's confusing to refer to 60i/1080 as "NTSC HD".

 

Currently 720P, 1080i, and 1080P are considered "high definition". 720 means 1280 x 720 pixels, 1080 means 1920 x 1080 pixels. But pretty much anything above standard definition broadcast formats (NTSC, PAL, SECAM, etc.) is considered high definition, although you hear terms of "extended definition" for some TV sets.

 

For example, DLP-Cinema projection is currently 1280 x 1040 pixels I believe and some people call that high definition.

 

Usually an HD format is defined by its pixel dimensions, field or frame rate, and whether it is progressive-scan or interlaced-scan.

 

There are various HD tape formats like HDV, HDCAM, HD-D5, DVCPRO-HD, HDCAM-SR that can handle some or all of the HD formats (720P, 1080i, 1080P at 24P, 25P, 30P, 50i, 60i, 60P, etc.) at different compression rates, bit rates, color sampling, etc.

 

So no, there is no universal HD format. Here in the US, we broadcast HDTV at 720/60P and 1080/60i even if we shot the material and posted it in formats like 24P/1080, etc.

 

The JVC HDV camera records 720P (I think) while the Sony HDV camera records 1080i. The Panasonic Varicam records 720/60P no matter what frame rate you shoot at, while the Sony F900 HDCAM records 1080 at 24PsF, 25PsF, 30PsF, 50i, and 60i.

[John Sprung]

I think it's confusing to refer to 60i/1080 as "NTSC HD".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Indeed, it's worse than confusing. It's incorrect.

 

NTSC was the National Television System Committee. Actually there were two of them. NTSC I started in the late 1930's, and finished up in the summer of 1940 with the 525 line black and white system being adopted by the FCC. This was not widely implemented at first, due mainly to WWII. NTSC II added color to the existing system. There's a bunch more history there, with the incompatible field sequential system being adopted and replaced. In any case, NTSC II finished its work with the adoption of its color system around Christmas in 1953. Bill Schreiber, now professor emeritus from MIT, may be the only guy left from the original NTSC.

 

ATSC, the Advanced Television Systems Committee, is responsible for the HD broadcast standard that was adopted by the FCC at the end of 1996. Other than Bill, I don't know of anybody from the original NTSC who was around for the ATSC process.

 

The new European system is called DVB-T. The important thing is that these are broadcast standards, not just image formats. The biggest difference between them is in channel coding, ATSC using 8-VSB while DVB-T uses COFDM. ATSC allows 24, 30, and 60 (and their "point nine something" versions) as frame and field rates. I'm not sure what DVB is doing with image structure, they do have a web site if you're interested:

 

http://www.dvb.org/

 

 

 

-- J.S.

[Michael Nash]

A good overview here:

 

http://www.tutorgig.com/ed/High-definition_television

[Guest Frank Gossimier]

I was reading over that link from Michael Nash. I guess nothing gets the USA moving faster than the thought of another country having a technology the USA doesn't have.....

 

"Additionally, in the 1980s there was a fear among many in the US that Japanese advances in HDTV would contribute to the further erosion of US leadership in electronics and other high-tech industries, not to mention the defense industry implications of having a high resolution television system."

 

Frank

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

As if the US had a tech lead to erode by the 80s!

 

It seems to be inculcated into the American population that the US is the best country in the world, always has been, always will be, and will always be absolutely the best at absolutely everything!

 

Phil

[Guest Andy Sparaco]

Hi,

 

As if the US had a tech lead to erode by the 80s!

 

It seems to be inculcated into the American population that the US is the best country in the world, always has been, always will be, and will always be absolutely the best at absolutely everything!

 

Phil

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

A short trip to Hong Kong or Shanghi (or Milan or Berlin) evaporates that illusion. Although the US is still the best place to start you own biness!

[Guest Frank Gossimier]

Canada is a pretty good place to start your own business, you get free health care and don't have to pay Social Security Tax. USA is good for self employment as well though.

 

Now come on Phil don't be like that. Do you want to shatter America's image?

 

Frank