How Old Is This Mitchell?

Matt Butler · May 13, 2005

I'm trying to find out the build date of a rack-over Mitchell #740.

I vaguely remember that a camera-buff had collected a list of these numbers.

I tried googling and found out more than I need to know about WW2 Mitchell bombers serial

numbers!

Any help in pointing me in the right direction would be appreciated.

Nate Downes · May 13, 2005

#740 would be a 50's-60's, my guess.

Stephen Williams · May 13, 2005

I'm trying to find out the build date of a rack-over Mitchell #740.
I vaguely remember that a camera-buff had collected a list of these numbers.

I tried googling and found out more than I need to know about WW2 Mitchell bombers serial

numbers!

Any help in pointing me in the right direction would be appreciated.

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Hi,

If you call Joe Dunton in the USA he has the original records and can tell you the delivery date and original owner.

www.joedunton.com

I would guess about 1947 as they were making about 50 a year and 576 was November 1943.

Good luck

Stephen Williams DP Zurich

www.stephenw.com

ljesmith · May 21, 2005

Which mitchell is it, because the Mitchell BNC cameras only went to #365. We currently have about 40 of them and I have been trying to find the history of them myself but it ain't easy. Movietech in London have #365 which is in mint condition.

Stephen Williams · May 21, 2005

Which mitchell is it, because the Mitchell BNC cameras only went to #365. We currently have about 40 of them and I have been trying to find the history of them myself but it ain't easy. Movietech in London have #365 which is in mint condition.

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Hi,

With 40 BNC's I guess you are in Bristol! Contact Joe Dunton with a list of serial no's and he will give you the information from the Mitchell Camera Co records.

Stephen

ljesmith · May 21, 2005

Hi Stephen, yes we are in Bristol, at Aardman to be exact. I used to work with Joe at Movietech and have tried getting the list of him but with no luck I'm afraid.

Stephen Williams · May 21, 2005

Hi Stephen, yes we are in Bristol, at Aardman to be exact. I used to work with Joe at Movietech and have tried getting the list of him but with no luck I'm afraid.

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Hi,

Call the USA office tel (+1) 910-343-1089, If Joe is not there explain what you want. I am sure they can help. I spoke to Joe 2 years ago at IBC, he was planning to put the records on the web. I guess that has not happened yet.

Stephen Williams

Cameraman

www.stephenw.com

Matt Butler · May 22, 2005

I emailed Joe Dunton on May 14 - no reply as yet,I guess he is a busy guy afterall.

This Mitchell has the pull-down shuttle of an NC type(metal gears with the claw mechanism on a slight down wards angle) and the main drive sprockect lay-out of a Standard & High Speed as illustrated in threading diagrams in American Cinematographer Manual 8th edition/2001.(pages531 &533)

Is this the layout of a GC or a custom version?

Stephen Williams · May 22, 2005

I emailed Joe Dunton on May 14 - no reply as yet,I guess he is a busy guy afterall.

This Mitchell has the pull-down shuttle of an NC type(metal gears with the claw mechanism on a slight down wards angle) and the main drive sprockect lay-out of a Standard & High Speed as illustrated in threading diagrams in American Cinematographer Manual 8th edition/2001.(pages531 &533)

Is this the layout of a GC or a custom version?

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Hi,

Can you post a photo? Many cameras have had the gates changed! Do the serial no's on the gate + pressure plate match the body? The serial no. implies a GC/ High Speed type as it has metal gears. Many Standard's had high speed gates and bearings fitted.

Stephen Williams DP

www.stephenw.com

Stephen Williams · May 23, 2005

Matt sent me a photo

Matt,

IMHO your camera is a GC Mitchell. It's not a NC movement!

Your camera is missing 2 loop rollers see

I have seen a 1940's military manuel and all the rollers are removed. IMHO it is better to have the rollers in place for higher speed shooting. I would loop the film over the 1 roller you have.

Stephen Williams DP

Zurich

www.stephenw.com

Nate Downes · May 23, 2005

And yes, I am very jealous of you for having one. The Rack-Over Mitchell is the camera I want to own one day.

Stephen Williams · May 24, 2005

And yes, I am very jealous of you for having one. The Rack-Over Mitchell is the camera I want to own one day.

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Hi,

They come up on Ebay all the time. The lowest serial no I have seen on Ebay is No 5 with a Fries Conversion. I know no 35 is in regular use on a Milo motion control in Germany.

Cheers

Stephen

Nate Downes · May 24, 2005

As I said: Rack Over

Fries conversion eliminates the rack-over capability to add reflex viewing. It also, incidentally, removes the variable shutter which is part of the reason I want one. The last true Rack-Over Mitchell on ebay went for over $8000, more than this poor guy can afford.

Now, there is a nice 16mm rackover Mitchell on there, but shipping from Sweeden would be insane.

Sam Wells · May 24, 2005

As I said: Rack Over

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Why ????

Hey get an S35R great camera, mirror reflex and variable (not when running) focal plane shutter.

We used to rent one all the time from Camera Mart, I got kinda proprietary about it: I'd pick it up and say "I'm here for my camera :). It didn't have a tap, the one that did was rented often, this one rarely was.

I should have tried to buy it when Camera Mart went under. "Everyone" wanted an Arri III by that point (not without reason).

coulda shoulda woulda....

-Sam

Stephen Williams · May 24, 2005

As I said: Rack Over

Fries conversion eliminates the rack-over capability to add reflex viewing. It also, incidentally, removes the variable shutter which is part of the reason I want one. The last true Rack-Over Mitchell on ebay went for over $8000, more than this poor guy can afford.

Now, there is a nice 16mm rackover Mitchell on there, but shipping from Sweeden would be insane.

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Hi,

The Fries 35 R has a beam splitter and retains the variable shutter. I was the high bidder on one 2 years ago at 2150 USD , in the end he sold for 3750 USD.

Cheers

Stephen

Stephen Williams · May 24, 2005

Why ????

Hey get an S35R great camera, mirror reflex and variable (not when running) focal plane shutter.

-Sam

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Sam,

You can motorise the shutter on an S35R and do speed ramps. I have many times with a motion control.

Stephen

Nate Downes · May 24, 2005

Why ????

Hey get an S35R great camera, mirror reflex and variable (not when running) focal plane shutter.

We used to rent one all the time from Camera Mart, I got kinda proprietary about it: I'd pick it up and say "I'm here for my camera :). It didn't have a tap, the one that did was rented often, this one rarely was.

I should have tried to buy it when Camera Mart went under. "Everyone" wanted an Arri III by that point (not without reason).

coulda shoulda woulda....

-Sam

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Hey, I'd take an S35R, but I like being able to change the shutter angle mid-shot. But, I work a crummy job and noone around here needs cinematographers so I could get extra income. Instead, they want Varicam operators willing to work for $25/day. I'm still laughing at that job offer.

Nate Downes · May 24, 2005

Hi,

The Fries 35 R has a beam splitter and retains the variable shutter. I was the high bidder on one 2 years ago at 2150 USD , in the end he sold for 3750 USD.

Cheers

Stephen

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I remember that one, good looking setup too.

But it's an impractical dream for me right now. I had to scrimp to get myself a pair of K-3's (and one of those was given to me).

Nate Downes · May 24, 2005

Sam,

You can motorise the shutter on an S35R and do speed ramps. I have many times with a motion control.

Stephen

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Did not know that. Will keep that in mind tho from now on.

At this point I'd just be happy to be working on something, however.

Stephen Williams · May 24, 2005

Did not know that. Will keep that in mind tho from now on.

At this point I'd just be happy to be working on something, however.

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The one thing to think about any Mitchell with a variable shutter is that they can flicker. Remember they are between 30 and 80 years old. I think Aardman removes the second blade for that reason, but retains the focal plane light tight shutter. Thats one big reason why most of the later Fries conversions were 35R3. Five years ago I needed to rebuild the shutter of an AF35R. Over 100 hours of workshop time! but I needed the variable shutter!

Stephen

Nate Downes · May 24, 2005

Well, in any case, a Mitchell of any calibur is out of my reach for the immediate future. I have to get some kind of career going with the K-3's I currently shoot with first.

Nate Downes · May 26, 2005

Altho if things work out, I might be getting one via the movie I'm working on, in lieu of part of my salary. *crossing fingers*

Webster Colcord · May 26, 2005

There's a GC package for sale on ebay right now- still under $1,000 with one 1/2 days left. Hope I'm not breaking the rules of the forum by posting this, it's not my sale...

It's item # 5519293683

Nate Downes · May 26, 2005

Even $1000 is out of reach for the immediate future, it's not as if I had credit cards to fall back on for such a purchase.

Stephen Williams · January 14, 2006

I'm trying to find out the build date of a rack-over Mitchell #740.
I vaguely remember that a camera-buff had collected a list of these numbers.

I tried googling and found out more than I need to know about WW2 Mitchell bombers serial

numbers!

Any help in pointing me in the right direction would be appreciated.

Hi Matt,

Kinemaman are selling Mitchell 745 on ebay #7580450946. They are stating 1947 as a build date, which agrees with what I said. The U.S. Government used to order thease cameras in batches of 10, so yours was probably delivered on the same day!

Cheers,

Stephen