Lav Bodnaruk

Hey Sam! Thanks for the great post mate! I am definitely going to take everything you said on board, as i was already thinking much along the lines of what you suggested, hoping that the lights on the night would be enough to go ahead with Xl1s perhaps, merely because of the budget restrictions - but the realist in me knows that wont be the case and that we will have to go with something along the lines of digi beta or betecam... Other option of using the DSR250P or 400P didnt really come to mind, but having just read your post i am very much interested in checking that out further. i am very familiar with the 250P having shot number of docos with it, so i guess i know what quality of work it can produce. Can't really say i did anything with the 400P though... Ill check with the renting company (ProCam or Lemac here in Brisbane) to what they also might advise me on, afterall they may have more insights into this then me as they own the gear... and i do have a feeling that their suggestions may be along your lines :) Again, thank you for the post and thank you for steering me away from the min35 and the Xl1/2 units... i wasn't sure what i was stepping into with that and can now firmly put it to rest, having received this adivce. Oh and the tip on the behind the scenes camera, roaming behind the musicians just sounds great! I have not thought of that and will see what the band reckons. It might be a tight squeeze there with 25 musicians and a cameraman, as there isnt much room in the 'behind' area - all more reason for me to ask for for some more detailed plans of the event, a visit to the stage, lighting check, etc... I will post back the dates of the event, once i find out what they are, in case any of your family from Brissy decide to check it out. The band is a formation from Melbourne, Sydney and Brisbane and are trually wonderful - not saying this cause i know them, but rather cause i love their music :) Cheers might! A trually wonderful post!

here is my 2 cents on the topic here, 'help me pic a cam' - don?t be afraid of 16mm BL. I have used it to shoot in collage and own one now. I have all the blimp housings for it which makes a great deal of difference as it can be used with primes now, easily changed over (really no hassle) and no skin of my nose. (Dont laugh at the site, it was made ages ago and the pics look pathetic) but students to come to rent.... http://www.lavproductions.com/cameraprice.html It is not that loud when serviced well, and oiled up properly - which you get to learn how to do when you own one. the magazines are not hard to load... the loop is not hard to get right in the tent, as there is a mark on the mag to where you should go to... I am not saying it is easier then say SRs, cause it isn?t, but it is not really complicated as sometimes people like to over exaggerate. further, its heavy and bulky, but not as much if you take that zoom lens off and that zoom lens blimp. in other words, with a prime lens and prime blimp it isnt scary heavy, i even put it on my Glidecam v20 and have really steady shots - you wouldn?t think of shooting steadicam with bl now would you? you can get a special magazine for steadicam work too, so not to screw up your balance...(im not actually advising on shooting steadicam with BL, rent an SR for that, but just saying... its all doable on student budgets and i have seen it done) for handheld work, a swan neck viewfinder is great. people are much against hand held work with this camera, but when i was shootng heavy with my unit, i had it down to such perfection, i used to prefer it to woring with anything else... i guess it is a matter of gettign used to. I even built a VIDEO TAP on my camera, which attaches onto the viewfinder (for steadicam/crane work). you can get one put in proffessionaly at Aranda Films, which they do through the door; get one with really good crystal sync, best would be to get Tobin -which referes back to the post from someone before me, Cinama Techic will be able to answer all the questions you have. They also have their own recommendation for this camera here, not very positive, but very realistic http://www.cinematechnic.com/resources/arri_16bl.html you can get a jensen 505 crystal sync unit, which i got 2 of, or even a Minilock which is England made (i also own one and they all do the trick) Conversion to super 16mm is possible, although i have never really seen one that is done very well. I have heard that http://www.arandafilm.com.au/ Aranda Film do it, but like i said, i am not able to confirm. I do know that Aranda Film is a wonderful company and that they are very much to be trusted to... so whatever they say, i would go for... lastly, ebay may not be your best option for this camera, as you should be able to hold it in your hand, listen to it... maybe see some footage that was shoot with it. I contemplated selling mine number of times, but having been collecting parts for it for years now, i am pretty sure i got it in a tip top collectors condition to sell away :D anyways, keep looking, collect more money and buy an SR, BUT if you are in a rush right now, BL is NOT a bad choice! you will learn heaps, you will shoot heaps, and no doubt it is a camera that will PAY IT SELF OFF quickly if you are lucky to get it for about 2K USD. (which i would never sell mine for) Best of luck

hi george, im not following, are you suggesting he shoots sound on mini dv say in 29.970fps, bring it into FCP and export as AIFF which will then match exactly his 16mm stuff that is shot on 24fps without any further alterations? Wouldn't it differ in duration and thefore fall out of sync? I personally dont think it would fall out heaps, and if it did it would only occur after a long time,which would only be a problem if there was no cut for a long time... But should he bring in the 29.970fps sound file into 24fps off line cut of his 16mm project, shouldnt he just change the speed on the sound file and get 100% matching sync-so he can have takes that go for 10minutes without any cuts :D ? No? Am i way off? ps. years ago i shot on a camera without crystal sync, that was varying terribly between 25 and 24 fps... the sound was captured on 25fps. in post, the sync wouldnt fall out untill 1:45 min after the initial sync point, which was more then we ever needed for our dialogue shots... not to mention that in every 'breathing gap' in dialogue you chould shift waveforms... of course this was terribly unproffessional, and i would deny it any time to being used for a paid gig, but none the less... the crystal lock sync unit broke on the day and it was best we could do. better get back to my PAL project editing...

hey Hal, I was actually just throwing my comment out there as I wanted to clarify that i was in the PAL country, so that my advice doesn’t become harmful :) But yeah, since on the subject of FPS, you wouldn’t actually believe how many people stress about shooting 24fps here in Oz. I don’t get it... I mean, even for theatrical release I’d always go for 25fps, which was recently argued out on my 35mm feature trailer thingy... of course if it is for TV/DVD release I wouldn’t even think about it twice... Others disagree and figure that going 24fps gives them that "Film Look"... so yeah, even though we have it simple, at times its the man that make it complicated with different opinions... And then of course there are the times when the budget does not exist, and then the filmmakers might decide to work with 24fps merely because that saves a lot of film in the overall picture! In this instance, the sound guy has to worry about recording his bit in 24fps too...or fixing it in post. Scott, I reckon you will be ok shooting 24fps and using your video camera to record sound at 29.970fps, but as a test, maybe you can shoot some video (or use some existing stuff) and put it in your FCP, adjusting the speed on the audio... I don’t know if that test would be sufficient enough in showing what result you would be facing by recording some dialogue with your camera on the day?! It could take as little as 2-3 hours for the test...and it would be matching the exact POST path you plan to have with your sound work anyways... not to mention that ideally you could shoot some film tests too, lens, stock, lighting, wardrobe, etc... all could be performed in that 100ft of film.

In my post i refer to using pd170 and 16mm cameras, all which was shot in Australia on 25fps. Just thought i throw that in. Good luck with the shoot Scott. I believe the AC would be essential to any crew, no matter the budget size or the difficulty of the project. worst case scenario, you should be able to call in help from your mates that also do camera (another DP perhaps) that will know what they are doing and will be able to help you. Number of times i helped out for free for mates, who did the same without any hessitation for me too.... and as you said, what you pay is what you get, but you should also argue that if it is soft or out of focus completely, they will be getting nothing but still paying something... now that is a rotten scenario. I dont mean to say it can't be done, i've done it at times myself, it is just easier (much) and quicker to have an AC at all time... a focus puller preciesly. Again, good luck, have fun and let us know how it went :D Cheers mate,

my first gear was DXC3000AP which i owned 3 of... the whole deal, with the U-matic back and 12 pin cords. Started off with docos then moved into basic studio production, practising vision switching with a board i still own... got few shows out of it on a community TV (which suggests the quality of it all :)) then came my 16mm BL on ARRI sticks, which is a beast. Collecting primes, blimp houses, and or any other extras became a hobby to a degree, as it meant being active on eBay as well as making few relationships overseas - with people that also collected. I shot few shorts, some video clips and thats about it... it paid itself off within the first two jobs; Just the same though, i think it makes for a great suvenir and a great items collector. it is still active and i migh consider shooting something with it again one day... although i rent these days and have not touched it in a while... i also got a camera stabilizing system, glidecam v20 that does great work. I dont Op it myself no more but rent it out to those that know how to use it, due to my neck injury (car accident, not v20). through a personal company with partners, we also got 1 pd170 and 1 Fx1; i also got heaps and heaps of stage lighting, mixers, smoke machines, etc etc... i can rig up an entire concert for a band for around 1000 people or more, including the set-up of the stage itself (wooden placks) further more i got some sound gear too, basicly a shot gun mic with some HDD recorder. next camera? Who knows... i might stick to renting till i know for sure... i like that GY-HD100 though, cause of its interchangeable lenses. A friend who recently bougth some 35mm gear: 2 x ARRI3s with high speed base, BL3, 2 sets of primes Mk1 & Mk2, sticks, matt boxes, etc etc had the idea to rent and pay off the loan which wasn't as easy as anticipated. I am not sure how it is going right now, it could have picked up but i remember the begining was though - breaking into the already existing renting market, even though the gear was wonderful condition!

cracked me up :D

Hi Scott, you can definitely record sound on the Mini DV camera and be fine with it. I have done so numerous times on PD170 whilst shooting on my 16mm BL or a rented SR2. As mentioned by Nick, you can also use the camera to record some behind the scenes stuff, but make sure that the person operating it doesnt get carried away with it for you dont want too much movement with it if those XLRs are stretched out over the floor. Also, make sure your settings are on top notch but i guess that would be common sense. You may even decide to shoot DV CAM since your camera can do that - as the durability of the format is better then that of Mini DV, but surely that opens up another discussion. (DV CAM media has 50% lower drop out rate). This option may also cost you a bit more - as DV CAM is priced much more over Mini DV so do read up on weather you really need to go that way or not, before hand... you may not want the Op to roam around in between the takes then, doing behind the scenes stuff ;) You can also slate this stuff easy, for obviously you can match up the two visions which will give you a synced sound. Now you just got to stop stressing about the sound and concentrate on your film stuff, your lighting and shots. Good luck,

Thanks for the advice Ash, i will definitely look into the pricing of the SDX900s! I hope we can afford to get enough to utalise both the steadicam and the crane i might be able to get for the couple of nigts. :) Cheers,

Hi Ash, thanks for the post. I guess that is the kind of advice that i was really after, seeing what people that have done a live event would do it on. my initial thoughts went to digi beta's but in attempting to keep the budet down we thought we consider the mini 35 which i never worked before... i knew lights would be a factor, but i have no idea how much more light it may be required to operate them properly... thanks for the input mate,

thought i bump up my post now that everyone has been receiving emails from Tim in regards to posting again or loosing an account. Perhaps some that may have had thoughts on my dilemma here, but held back previously, could express an opinion :blink: Thanks guys!

Great reel. I too agree with G. McMahon in regards to maybe including some sequences, but awesome none the less.

Hi there, i have recently posted a topic in general discussions about this particular event that i am to shoot in October, but am now placng a topic in this particular part of the forum for I am very interestd in covering it with the XL1/XL2 with P&S adaptro and some fast lenses? I guess what i would realy like to hear is from someone that has used either of these cameras with the adaptor and can tell me what they think of it? Also, how much light do they generaly require (to the nearest F stop) and weather you would do the live performance with them or any other CCD camera/Digi betacam. The event itself is to take place in the Brisbane Powerhouse theatre stage and i wish to use about 3-4 cameras to cover 2 nights - 1 camera on crane, 1 on steadicam and 2 on the seats across the stage filming this 25 piece band. Any info would be awesome! Cheers. PS. here is the link to my previous post that explains the actual event to a bit more detail: http://www.cinematography.com/forum2004/in...showtopic=15951

any1 else got any thoughts to which format live stuff should best be filmed with?

Hi Adam, I too look forward to checking out the behind the scenes and agree with Paul on all that he said. If Mike gets a chance to share his lighting set-up that would be awesome, i'd be interested in hearing about his INT scenes. cheers,

man you got some sweet answers here, i read your question and wanted to help answer, but pretty much all has been said already. :D good luck hunting down those short ends.

thanks for the post Matt, ive sent you a PM! What do you guys think about the XL1/XL2 to PL mount adapter instead of the P&S? I guess the units would be about 10m from the subjects at all times, how do you think an operator would cope with focus with that unit? is it realy live event gear or reserved for shooting narrative? Cheers,

thanks guys, Unfortunately i am not able to get the reading of the ligts on the stage from anyone at the venue, although i am hoping that between now and the show there will be one similar gig, that i can step in to watch with my light meter... that should answer how he/she does the lights; Are you able to suggest any particular camera set-up from what i have written or are there too many variables still? I too have heard that xl1/xl2 with cine adaptor requires one stop more, but have never used it to be able to confirm it... has anyone shot with xl2 + cine adaptor? How about Digi BETAs, does anyone have experience filming with those beasts and cutting on off-line? I could get the footage onto my HDDs through a mate that works for the DVD authoring company; Here is the PDF of the Lemac catalogue, which shows the cameras I am able to rent for the gig http://www.lemac.com.au/rental/rentfr.html Regarding monitors and communicaton with operators, I own nice headphone/mic sets that are quite good and will allow me to talk to the ops. I also plan to run BNC leads from their units to wherever i may be sitting, monitoring every shot (even though i am not cutting) just to make sure framings are matching... I did think about renting a vision switcher (i own a crap analogue one) but that would result in not perfect edit and i wouldnt be able to mix and match between two performances. I'd rather do that in the edit with plenty of time between production and delivery date. The band is large, so they are not moving too much. They do play Gypsie music, so it is lively... They do have songs when a string section sits down and so on, but on average there i always 20 of them on the stage... How can i best get CUs of each one of them if they are almost masking one another? Is the crane an answer? Ill try and get my hands on Talking Heads! :D I just watched U2 concert filmed in Boston, boy that too a lot of planning and preparaton and it was all in lighting, one thing i am not able to control.... Thanks heaps guys! please do let me know what camera set-up you would give preferance to. Cheers,

Hey guys, I got a bit of quiry on my mind that i thought i would like to share in case you can help me out with few suggestions. Recently I was asked to film a LIVE concert for a band. They do not yet have a set budget, but as they have helped me previously on my film projects I wish to look after them the best i can on 'cost-only' basis kind-a thing. Ok, so they are playing at this venu for 4 nights in a raw. They area 25 piece orchestra, standing on the stage that is about 1 meter tall. In front of them are about 10 round tables with about 8 seats each and further more, there are stands that go up to 10meters high. Here is a picture that illustrates the space a bit better: http://www.brisbanepowerhouse.org/content/...file&id=129 The picture here does not show the 1m tall stage, which would be where the band in the photo is located. Also, the 'hole' in which some people are sitting in the pic is to be closed and there will be tables there - hopefully everyone remains sitting at the tables so if the cameras are on eye level view is not distrupted. Of course i could place cameras higher up too.... From the pic you can also see the the lighting grid. It is definitely present and from what i understand they vary colours on the backdrop completely randomly. Unfortunately i am not to have any control over it and fear that it may not be enough light for my cameras, hence the dilema in choosing the right once.... Further more, the lighs may be a reason why I would choose to film 2 out of 4 performances, as editing it together between 4 different once may not work continuity wise... this may cut costs down a bit allowing for better rental of the gear on the 2 nighs of filming. So what would you suggest? How many cameras and located where? Which cameras? (event taking place in Brisbane Australia, PAL 50hz 25fps) I am to edit it on my home off line suite, which can be either Final Cut HD or Premier Pro 2 HD, but either way it isnt on-line... I am to author it into a DVD that can be sold. If I can save money during production I might afford to get into telecine for some colouring initialy, should that be needed?? I thought of maybe doing TWO digi beta's on eye level, on the stand (one on each side) and doing two nights like that. Perhaps i can get the media to be imported onto HDDs that can be brought over for my off-line cut? (I've never shot Digi Beta beforee) Other option was to get 3CCD cameras (which unit in particular i dont know) to do the same - 2 large cameras on the stands. I could then afford to maybe have a crane in as well with one smaller 3CCD unit on it and maybe even a steadicam (I own glidecam v20) with smaller unit roaming on that? Last option was to consider those XL1s or XL2s with film lens adaptors and 35mm lenses on them? What do you think of that? That would probably allow for crane or something too - budget wise i mean... I could always try and talk them into putting a dolly between the stage and the audience but that might be hard to organise... as people present will be paying good money to watch them; My main fear is that I wont be able to get good CUs of anyone on the stage if shooting from stands only. Let me know what you guys think and what formats live events as this one are usually recorded with? PS. The SOUND is not to be worried about, they got other guys onto that - real pro's with real budget! PS2. I am allocating budget wise for at least 2 other DPs to be present (hopfully once that have experience in this live event shooting) and any other crew neccessary for the crane/steadicam to work; Thanks heaps for any input!

that completely slipped by my, i should have noticed it too in my earlier comment - if i was operating, mine or rented, id want to balance it myself. its ok to get help in a certain case but none the less its the ops job. Plus in Brissy i dont think you could rent a rig without an operator...

have you yet posted at the stedicam forum? although surely you should be able to pick up an experienced op through an agency.... cheers,

I thought adam said "too much steadicam" which is a vaild opinion... but exactly that, his opinion... I might not agree because i own n op stabilizer (glidecam) n love seeing it on screen... so yeah, i dont see how that is having a go at anyone other then adam's review,... im confused to see brad react?! Oh well my english isnt the best to follow this one through guys...

I dont know wy but that line just made me laugh :D maybe cause it was so to the point... Cheers, Oh and again for the record Dan's previous book is better... :D

Hi Tim, did Steve sell the camera? I wasnt in town to see the end of it and for some reason it aint in my 'watched' items, so i am just curious if you knew how much it went for and if he were happy? Thanks mate! And heel_e (Tim No#2), how much are you asking for on your HS? Cheers!

ok, so I saw the film last night. It definitely wasn?t as bad as some talked it up to be... I mean, I didn?t like it, there was no suspense, the action was weak and don?t get me started on the whole ?code breaking? ? that wasn?t even addressed properly, it didn?t allow the viewer to even consider the breaking of the code (which the book does to a degree) and some shots I'd definitely question... Even though I wasn?t a big fan of the book I think that the bunch of stuff they left out from it, was rather vital, for now they were left with a story that was dull and meaningless (not that the book was a fat stretch from that, but it was much better then this film, if that makes sense). So I would say it is definitely worth questioning the screen play writer and the process of it all - how quickly was it done, what supervision, what research... etc etc... we all already know that these Hollywood blockbuster formulated pictures are all the same and are nothing but a quick buck for many involved... I sure see arguments of the screen writers, that they had to translate the 10hours from the book into less then couple for the big screen, but yeah... I guess I'd say, thats what a good script writer is meant to do... i don't know; I didn?t mind the grain so much. I wasn't impressed with the inconsistency of it, having it in one shot and not the next, but other then that I didn?t mind it... However, I did mind that the film was predominantly set in 'dark' locations, so much so that I felt a headache after a while? and I also wasnt a fan of the car chase, that whoe "SMART CAR"... So much marketing went into that vehicle, there were some parked infront of the theatre with the "Da Vinci Code" stickers... and it was in there for 10min in a bad car chase, that obviously lacked wide shots. Soft shots wise, I think I saw over 20! I just assume it was the projection, because I could never believe they would release a film like that... I did see it at a Megaplex, hence why the poor projecting wouldn?t surprise me? ($5 bucks a ticket AUD ? huge screen but, best value in town no doubt) Hope my opinion doesn?t offend anyone. It is just that, an opinion. After all it is not like I had much choice in seeing many other things on there, remember I was at the Megaplex surrounded by number of other wonderful films, so I ought to give the Davinci Code a break and move on...