Thomas James Posted January 7, 2007 Share Posted January 7, 2007 As far as double blind testing is concerned this technique has universal scientific value and is not just limited to pharmacuetical testing. As a matter of fact Consumer Reports uses double blinded testing methods when evaluating the picture quality of high definition televisions. Because brand identification can be so prejudicial to the findings of a picture quality evaluation team Consumer Reports has actually put masking paper around the perimeter of the screen so that judgements could be made without any knowledge of the brand of the televisions. This has caused Consumer Reports to give a higher rating to a JVC HD television over a comparable priced Sony HD television which is an almost impossible achievement because most experts regard JVC as an inferior brand. Therefore I can only conclude that the negative review from CNET is only because of the authors unfair bias against single chip cameras. Taken to an extreme this unfair bias against single chip cameras has caused the demise of high end HD cameras like Dalsa 4k digital cimnema and Panavision Genesis wich some do not take seriously because they employ only a single chip. Sadly even on JVC's own website there was found self hating confessions from JVC salesmen that the JVC lacked the color fidelity of a three chip standard definition camcorder even though the Japanese engineers so tried to explain the superiority of its hybrid primary complimentary color filteration system that not only blows away 3CCD standard definition camcorders but rivals even 3 CCD high definition camcorders. That being said the recorded resolution of the JVC 720p camcorder will be 4:2:0 which will yield 640x320 color resolution. So unless the DVX is able to record 4:4:4 color which I seriously doubt the color resolution of the DVX will only be 360x240 which is far inferior to the JVC. As far as latitude is concerned this has nothing to do with how many chips the camera has but rather the combined surface area of the chips. Since the JVC has a single one third inch chip its lattitude will be equivalent to a 1080p camera employing 3 quarter inch chips or a 720p camera employing 3 one fifth inch chips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas James Posted January 7, 2007 Share Posted January 7, 2007 Oh by the way as an afterthought to really exploit the superior color reproduction of the JVC GR-HD1 over the DVX you will need to hook it up to the new Mitsubishi HD television that has 6 color display capability. Traditional televisions can only display red green and blue but the Mitsubishi can display all 6 colors which are red green an blue plus yellow orange and purple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Smith Posted January 7, 2007 Share Posted January 7, 2007 My reference to drug testing was one of sarcasm, I was trying to get the point across that in the greater scheme of things the subject we are discussing is relatively unimportant. I want you to understand something: I don't CARE what camera I use, I am totally brand neutral. I would use a camcorder made out of beer cans and silly string if I thought it would give a great image. The facts are simply this: I looked at clips of the HD1, and didn't like them. My subjective opinion was that the DVX produced better colors. I don't CARE what your japanese engineers say about the chip design, that's my subjective opinion. Of course you are welcome to your own opinion, unfortunately for you it seems more people agree with me, and when you deal with completely subjective value judgments numbers win. You can go on and on about sampling this and filtration that, but at the end of the day the JVC image just isn't as pleasing to the eye for me, and quoting a camcorder's on-paper statistics ain't gonna change that. So what is your deal? I checked up on you, and it seems you are a total JVC groupie, bouncing from site to site hawking your JVC kool-aid. Do you own a metric crapload of stock or are you a paid shill? This site must be lightly moderated if you haven't been banned for trolling by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmo Liiva Posted January 7, 2007 Author Share Posted January 7, 2007 Well, looks like i have dpne my choice, i may have to work some extra months to gain that money, but i want that DVX 100B :) Thank you who helped me out, i couldn't never made that decision by myself and this kind of money is not a piece of cake for teenager to waste :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmo Liiva Posted January 7, 2007 Author Share Posted January 7, 2007 I just found one site: http://www.pcworld.com/product/pricing/prt...er/pricing.html Is it the same camera, it is right? And what sellers do you reccomend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 7, 2007 Premium Member Share Posted January 7, 2007 What country are you in, Timmo? Finland? If you are in a PAL/SECAM country, you should be looking for the PAL version of the DVX100B, the one that does 25P/50i, not the NTSC version that does 24P/30P/60i. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmo Liiva Posted January 7, 2007 Author Share Posted January 7, 2007 I live in Estonia, we don't have no shops selling those products. Thanks for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Smith Posted January 7, 2007 Share Posted January 7, 2007 I just found one site:http://www.pcworld.com/product/pricing/prt...er/pricing.html Is it the same camera, it is right? And what sellers do you reccomend? I need you to listen to me VERY carefully, ok? if you get a new 100b you need to buy from an authorized dealer, and ONLY an authorized dealer, alright? There are alot of scam shops out there that will rip you off, they will advertise a much lower price than normal, but when you try to order you'll find out that the price was only for the camera and they'll try to sell you all the accessories for an outrageous price that adds up to be way more than what an authorized dealer would sell it for to begin with. Even if you somehow managed to get a camera delivered from them, when you sent in the paperwork to Panny you would find out that you got a grey market camera and you would be denied your rebate, warranty, and all the extra goodies, like Barry's book and the Magic Bullet software. Here is a thread with a list of authorized dealers and identified scam shops:click here they also have a market place on dvxuser.com and if you think you might be interested in a used DVX you would do well to look there. P.S. I see Abel cine is a sponsor here, you might consider buying from them as they are authorized and I've had great service before with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas James Posted January 7, 2007 Share Posted January 7, 2007 Banned for what? For thinking that JVC is better than Panasonic? At DVXuser.com I rarely mention JVC because I think it is inappropriate because it is a forum about Panasonic products. Cinematography.com however is not limited to fans of just Panasonic products but it is open to fans of JVC products as well. If you disagree with a post then you can offer a rebuttal or simply ignore it. But far too often I see fans of a particular brand try to run fans of other brands out of town and this is not right. Usually money settles the argument of who stays and go. Maybe you want to ban me because I won't back off and again that is not true. If the conversation is over the conversation is over and I have no problem with that. But when someone calls me a troll I feel I have to defend myself because that is simply not true and even my accusers have admitted that am polite. But if you still feel that way then so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Drysdale Posted January 7, 2007 Share Posted January 7, 2007 David's correct in a PAL country you should really be thinking about a 25P or 50i, not a 24p, 30p, 60i camera. Otherwise, the post production will only bring you grief because everything in TV & video is set up to handle 25 frames per second. You should make a list of the cameras available in your price range and look for online reviews and tests of these cameras. From these you can tell which one of these cameras will best meet your needs. You won't get 100%, but it should get you started. Also, don't forget the audio requirements, ideally for serious work you'll want XLRs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 7, 2007 Premium Member Share Posted January 7, 2007 David's correct in a PAL country you should really be thinking about a 25P or 50i, not a 24p, 30p, 60i camera. Otherwise, the post production will only bring you grief because everything in TV & video is set up to handle 25 frames per second. I believe the PAL version has an "E" at the end, like "DVX100BE". Anyway, I think Estonia would be a 50i / 50 Hz country, so Timmo should get the PAL version and shoot 25P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicholas Jenkins Posted January 7, 2007 Share Posted January 7, 2007 I believe the PAL version has an "E" at the end, like "DVX100BE". Anyway, I think Estonia would be a 50i / 50 Hz country, so Timmo should get the PAL version and shoot 25P. Good call on that David, completely sliped my mind that he might not be in a 30i/24p country... DUH! :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgar Smith Posted January 7, 2007 Share Posted January 7, 2007 (edited) Look Thomas, I don't know you and have nothing personal against you, but I was irritated by your comment that my opinion is based on bias against the JVC. The basic of your argument seems to be that since the JVC is better on paper and in theory, it IS better, therefore the fact that most people think there are other cameras that perform better than the JVC can only be because of bias. Sorry, not buying it, people can be biased, but not to that extent. I've owned many different brands of cameras, and for this last purchase i specifically made a point to look at JVC because I've never owned one before. I choose the DVX over the JVC for the simple reason that the DVX better fit what I had in mind. I don't know, maybe the JVC better fit your needs. Like I said before, I don't care about brand, if Joe Blow builds a camera out of beer cans and silly string that gives a great image and has useful features I'm buying it. It looks like we might be dangerously close dragging this thread off topic, so, if either of us would like to continue this discussion let's resort to PMs and concentrate on getting this guy a camera, OK? Good call on that David, completely sliped my mind that he might not be in a 30i/24p country... DUH! :unsure: I never thought of it either, even though the name might have been a give away, lol. Here's a link to a short film from a group of teenagers from Finland that shows just what a PAL DVX can do: click here As for where to buy one, since I've only bought in the USA I frankly have no clue how or where one would go about purchasing a camera anywhere else, lol. :P Edited January 7, 2007 by Edgar Smith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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