Robert Giampa Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 This may be a stupid statement, but I have been trying to look at some 24p footage (shot with any 24p camrea) online to get an idea of what it looks like, but I can't seem to find any examples of it anywhere! Maybe I HAVEseen it a million times but just don't know that I have. Anybody know any good sites that might have some examples of things shot in 24p? Thanks, Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allen Achterberg Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 This may be a stupid statement, but I have been trying to look at some 24p footage (shot with any 24p camrea) online to get an idea of what it looks like, but I can't seem to find any examples of it anywhere! Maybe I HAVEseen it a million times but just don't know that I have. Anybody know any good sites that might have some examples of things shot in 24p? Thanks, Robert <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah man, go to this link and look around you will see that it offers a free DVD. click the thing that says free dvd right under the how to buy thing just to the right of the camera. http://catalog2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/s...atGroupId=14569 Best of luck man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 13, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 13, 2005 You can see 24P HD photography on shows like "Joan of Arcadia" and "Star Trek: Enterprise" on TV, not to mention most sitcoms, or you could rent DVD's of movies shot in 24P HD like my own "Jackpot" or films like "Star Wars: Attack of the Clones", "Session 9", "Starship Troopers 2", "Masked and Annoymous", "Lovely and Amazing", etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted January 13, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 13, 2005 Hi, It's better to watch it on TV, if you possibly can (and you can), since if you watch it on a computer, it'll inherently be deinterlacing it - however badly - just to make it viewable on a computer monitor. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cineshooter Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Just curious, Why are you so desperate (I think is the way you phrased it) to see 24P footage, just to see it or are you considering working in that medium? JD www.cineshooter.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Giampa Posted January 13, 2005 Author Share Posted January 13, 2005 Just curious,Why are you so desperate (I think is the way you phrased it) to see 24P footage, just to see it or are you considering working in that medium? JD www.cineshooter.com <{POST_SNAPBACK}> haha I am not actually desperate to see 24p, but I am just very curious to see it. It seems to be a very hot topic amongst certain people, and I would like to check it out. Mainly, one of the projects I have coming up is hovering between shooting on 16mm film or 24p video. I want to shoot 16mm (because I like the look and am used to lighting for it), but really can't honestly say no to 24p without judging some footage or shooting a little bit with it. One of the guys who is putting up the cash for this music video really wants to shoot 24p, but I don't think he's seen any footage from it either. I think he's just read about how it has a more 'film like' appearance. I want to be able to judge that for myself before deciding which one to use for the project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cineshooter Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Ah - sorry wrong phrasing - I think (strictly a personal opinion) that many people (who are footing the bill for a project) want to shoot progressive so they can: a) tell people they've shot progressive (they think they are cutting edge) B) think they will say a bunch of money c) can edit the piece themselves, or for a lot cheaper than a project shot on film d) are curious to check out the new medium that will 'kill' film As for a guy such as yourself the camera choice as well as the medium will mean alot, some are better than others, stars wars shot that thing a couple of years ago on the sony cinealta using a progressive 24p technology, and then there are the small hand sized 24p cameras, so that will make a big differnce too.....anyway thanks for answering my question and best of luck with your project.... Peace, JD www.cineshooter.com why is there a little yellow head in my posting? did i accidently do something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Wendell_Greene Posted January 13, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 13, 2005 Check out www.refusedtv.com and check out Lex Halaby's reel. He shot a music video for Chimaira using the DVX-100 camera. You can find other examples in the archives at www. mvwire.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted January 13, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 13, 2005 Hi, There's a little yellow head in your posting because it thinks that "c" followed by ")" is an attempt to insert one of those inane little smiley-face graphics. :) As for your other points, it's almost unavoidable that people shooting any kind of video, particularly lower-end video on something like a DVX-100, will save money. I mean, c'mon, elephant standing in corner. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filip Plesha Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 David.. which sitcoms are shot on HD, give me a few popular examples.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 14, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 14, 2005 David.. which sitcoms are shot on HD, give me a few popular examples.. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> As far as I know, the majority now are shot in 24P HD, but ones that come to mind are "Bernie Mac", "Reba"... I don't watch sitcoms so I can't even tell you some titles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Alessandro Machi Posted January 14, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 14, 2005 How come SOME 24P has weird blurry overlap motions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted January 14, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 14, 2005 Hi, Can you be any more specific? Which 24P in particular, how are you watching it, and can you compare the problems you're seeing to anything else? Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 14, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 14, 2005 You can shoot at shutter speeds longer than a film camera allows, like at 1/24th at 24P, whereas most film cameras can't shoot longer than 1/48th at 24 fps. This gains you more exposure at the expense of more motion blur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member John Sprung Posted January 14, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 14, 2005 Some digital cameras can give you shutter angles up to 350 degrees. Watch that on a plasma display with its inherent lag, and you can get some extreme blur. -- J.S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Alessandro Machi Posted January 14, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 14, 2005 Good info, thanks guys! So the next question is, are there situations where 24P and the extended shutter range looks perfectly fine on an HD monitor but when it is downcoverted to standard definition the motion blur/overlap is evident, and for me anyways, annoying? Does the issue of how a 24P shutter choice will look after being downconverted to standard definition ever come up when a scene is being shot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 14, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 14, 2005 A downconversion doesn't affect the amount of motion blur in the frame. The only thing you might sense is the 3:2 pulldown when converting 24P to 60i, but if you notice that at all, it's a form of judder, not smearing. When shooting 24P, you do notice more flickering that gets reduced when converting it to 60i or transferred to film for projection with a twin-bladed shutter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Allen Posted January 15, 2005 Share Posted January 15, 2005 which sitcoms are shot on HD, give me a few popular examples.. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Bernie Mac is an example... I got the HD tapes sitting right here to prove it. Also when you are talking 24p, we've been really talking 24p HD - if you are thinking of 24p SD, that's a little different because the lattitude is not generally as high and so it looks "less like film." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Giampa Posted January 15, 2005 Author Share Posted January 15, 2005 Also when you are talking 24p, we've been really talking 24p HD - if you are thinking of 24p SD, that's a little different because the lattitude is not generally as high and so it looks "less like film." <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That totally makes sense... I think the Bernie Mac show looks great, but some of the stuff that I have seen (thanks to you guys for the help!) that was shot on the lower end SD 24p cameras I thought didn't look that great. This explanation goes a long way toward explaining that for me. I honestly didn't know that there was HD 24p! For those of us not immersed in the industry, who are just cruising the internet and trying to get as much information as possible, it's pretty hard to figure out what was shot with what. Trade secrets, I guess :) Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Donis Posted January 15, 2005 Share Posted January 15, 2005 I've seen footage shot with the DVX100 look very good - if you can control the lighting, then the dynamic range issue isn't a problem really B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Alessandro Machi Posted January 15, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 15, 2005 I just checked out Bernie Mac, Joan of Arcadia, and Star Trek, the Final Adventure of the First Chapter...they are all on at the same time! Bernie Mac had serious noise in the reds, it looked worse to me than nicely shot BetaCam SP, Joan of Arcadia had awful banding on the faces, Star Trek looked pretty good and they were pretty aggressive with dollying down the corridor, Star Trek looked minimally minimally slightly weird to me during the dollying shots, but I'm really picky when it comes to finding motion artifacts of any kind so it's actually quite acceptable. Bernie Mac and Joan of Arcadia are probably being downconverted so I'm assuming it looks much better on HD than on SD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 15, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 15, 2005 With all the compression that digital broadcasting does, whether cable or satellite, you can't really judge smearing, noise, etc. -- it may or may not be in the original. UPN on my satellite has an awful amount of color lag; it's like a face moves and the color follows half a beat later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Alessandro Machi Posted January 15, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 15, 2005 David, have you noticed if the color lag you speak of is primarily on the "broadcast" channels? A couple of years ago I noticed that the "non-cable" channels such as CBS, NBC, ABC, Fox, UPN had lag , but NONE of the original cable channels (such as MTV,CNN,USA etc) had lag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 15, 2005 Premium Member Share Posted January 15, 2005 It's sort of hit and miss, but most of my cable channels look good. I've just never seen UPN (Channel 13) look good in Los Angeles, whether on cable or satellite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberto Hernandez Posted January 15, 2005 Share Posted January 15, 2005 I read somewhere that the WB's Jack and Bobby is shot in HD does anyone know of this or has anyone watched. I've tried to compare it to similar shows on the WB that I know are shot on 35 or 16 and I don't see much of a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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