Freya Black Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 You must have got a good one. I must have heard the ACs and ADs say 25 times on my shoot, "so glad that's not a RED product." R, I heard the same with my shoot last week, we had 2 Epics & shot for 37 hours over 3 days, both cameras were perfect. It's more of a 'people problem' rather like horror stories of film being scratched or fogged on every shoot! Gotta say this and some of you aren't going to like this, but actually there is two sides to that story. Firstly that Red has gained itself a reputation for being unreliable which is probably now hard to shake, but the other side of the coin, is that all those people are saying "glad it's not a Red" as if Red is the other option. Theres Alexa and then there is Red. That is a real marketing coup on the part of Mr Jim Jannard! Sony has lusted after that market for decades and now people talk about Red in the same breath as they talk about the Alexa. Maybe not in glowing terms but it's clear that people see it as being Red or Alexa. If you talk of digital cinema it would be rare for people to think of the F65 and even rarer for them to consider Panasonic or other brands. (Especially bad for Panasonic who had a massive lead in this area and have let if fall away.) It's really a massive achievement on the part of the Red people. love Freya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Kolze Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Next you will tell me all 60 Alexa's are still have the original fan Saw one being stopped out yesterday easy 5 minute job! No I can't claim that one for sure. But the ease of swapping out the fan in the Alexa is a nice design. Every camera has it's good and bad. I just don't care for bashing any brand particularly when all of the factors are not taken into consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 is that all those people are saying "glad it's not a Red" as if Red is the other option. Theres Alexa and then there is Red. That is a real marketing coup on the part of Mr Jim Jannard! Sony has lusted after that market for decades and now people talk about Red in the same breath as they talk about the Alexa. Maybe that is one possible interpretation. When I hear people say, "glad it's not a RED product" on set, I view that as more of a situation where RED has become common due to its price point. And is therefore seen on a lot of lower end productions. Apparently even now changing a battery on a RED camera is a much longer process than on the Alexa, and this is rather annoying to ACs. R, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freya Black Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Maybe that is one possible interpretation. When I hear people say, "glad it's not a RED product" on set, I view that as more of a situation where RED has become common due to its price point. And is therefore seen on a lot of lower end productions. Apparently even now changing a battery on a RED camera is a much longer process than on the Alexa, and this is rather annoying to ACs. R, I don't think it matters whether it's because of it being cheaper or what the reason is, it does seem like it is alexa and red. Here in the uk, the lower end productions tend to shoot on DSLR's, although it depends on what you call lower end. I mean soap operas over here are now shooting on Alexa. I see a lot of overlap between the two here (Red and Alexa) with Alexa having the lions share. Point is that Sony wouldn't get as much of a thought and I suspect that people wouldn't even think of anything else as falling into a similar category. Some of that may be victory by default (90% of success is turning up) but I feel Sony have and are making an effort, yet so far... Of course that might be all about to change, the world is full of change, that is where we are now tho. love Freya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Stephen Williams Posted November 16, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 16, 2012 I don't think it matters whether it's because of it being cheaper or what the reason is, it does seem like it is alexa and red. Here in the uk, the lower end productions tend to shoot on DSLR's, although it depends on what you call lower end. I mean soap operas over here are now shooting on Alexa. I see a lot of overlap between the two here (Red and Alexa) with Alexa having the lions share. Point is that Sony wouldn't get as much of a thought and I suspect that people wouldn't even think of anything else as falling into a similar category. Some of that may be victory by default (90% of success is turning up) but I feel Sony have and are making an effort, yet so far... Of course that might be all about to change, the world is full of change, that is where we are now tho. love Freya I think it's down to the production' companies workflow, companies who have been working with Red for several years want 5k & nothing else. I think Sony will find this the biggest hurdle however good their cameras are. I let the production company choose what to shoot, yesterday was Epic, Monday is 35mm film , sort of Rolex / Omega choice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted November 17, 2012 Author Premium Member Share Posted November 17, 2012 Does anybody know how many Alexas are out in the field now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Steven Beverly Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 All right, all right. Mr Boddington is currently listed among the Greatest Living Canadians, alive, dead, fictional, non-existent or not actually Canadian but with a body that would have Straight men weak at the knees and Gay men wishing they were Lesbians... All right, all right. Mr Boddington is currently listed among the Greatest Living Canadians, alive, dead, fictional, non-existent or not actually Canadian but with a body that would have Straight men weak at the knees and Gay men wishing they were Lesbians... OK I'll give ya that one, though Eva was hotter in my opinion, ever see her in that Christmas outfit, whoa baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Stephen Williams Posted November 17, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 17, 2012 Maybe that is one possible interpretation. When I hear people say, "glad it's not a RED product" on set, I view that as more of a situation where RED has become common due to its price point. And is therefore seen on a lot of lower end productions. Apparently even now changing a battery on a RED camera is a much longer process than on the Alexa, and this is rather annoying to ACs. R, I use V mount batteries, I have the action products Electra module so can hot swap, so about 5 seconds. If you had to power down the camera & change the battery then under 30 seconds. I think there are many amateur owned packages that get rented that are not well equipped for pro shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted November 17, 2012 Author Premium Member Share Posted November 17, 2012 OK I'll give ya that one, though Eva was hotter in my opinion, ever see her in that Christmas outfit, whoa baby! I enjoyed watching them both, but I thought Xenia was a better comedian. She'd be just about perfect for playing Brigitte Bardot... The dead ... do not care about Dynamic Range.... Kai; last of the Brunnen-G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted November 17, 2012 Author Premium Member Share Posted November 17, 2012 I think there are many amateur owned packages that get rented that are not well equipped for pro shooting. Whereas there ain't gonna be too many amateur-owned Alexas out there :rolleyes: But it's the same old same ol' same ol'; the camera body only makes up a relatively small part of the rental package, so it's not going to cost you a lot more to rent an Alexa, and if rightly or wrongly a customer thinks the Alexa is better for their purposes, that's what they will ask for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted November 17, 2012 Author Premium Member Share Posted November 17, 2012 I let the production company choose what to shoot, yesterday was Epic, Monday is 35mm film , sort of Rolex / Omega choice! Some people might say that's more a Casio/Rolex choice. :P They might say that, I'm not saying they actually will... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Stephen Williams Posted November 17, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 17, 2012 Whereas there ain't gonna be too many amateur-owned Alexas out there :rolleyes: But it's the same old same ol' same ol'; the camera body only makes up a relatively small part of the rental package, so it's not going to cost you a lot more to rent an Alexa, and if rightly or wrongly a customer thinks the Alexa is better for their purposes, that's what they will ask for. My Epic rents for the same as an Alexa :D BTW Rolex used the Epic & Omega will use 35mm on Monday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Holland Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 Stephen whats the situation in Switzerland regards film labs ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Stephen Williams Posted November 17, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 17, 2012 Stephen whats the situation in Switzerland regards film labs ? I will tell you on Tuesday! For the last 3 years there was only 1, which processed on demand if pre-booked. Negative is generally quite dirty. Even 10 years ago 10,000 feet would have been a big day for the lab. Budgets are crap so shooting a commercial with 800 / 1200 foot is quite normal. Lab prices have always been much higher than London. If I know I will rap at 5, I can organize processing for 5.30, telecine 6.30 & be home for 8.00! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Stephen Williams Posted November 19, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 19, 2012 Stephen whats the situation in Switzerland regards film labs ? Hi John, the lab asked if they could hold the film & process it when we shoot some more in 10 days time......They will process for a 100% surcharge which we will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freya Black Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Hi John, the lab asked if they could hold the film & process it when we shoot some more in 10 days time......They will process for a 100% surcharge which we will do. What does that mean a 100% surcharge? Do you mean like minimum lab fees or something? I think it's daft so many commercials are shot digitally now. Okay some commercials have very high ratios, and some commercials even need to have very high ratio's but if you are shooting something that is only 30seconds or so long, and you kept your ratio's low, then potentially it's going to be just as cheap, if not cheaper to shoot 35mm and if you are trying to sell people something then surely the look of your ad is going to be preety damn important! I accept sometimes that cameras like the red might have a certain look you want in certain situations (although I see few ads going for that look) I think it's directors with a lack of confidence or low self esteem who need to see a preview to reassure themselves or something. Then again it's not like there isn't a video tap. I don't get it to be honest. Wish I had something to advertise. I'd love to shoot commercials on 35mm!!! :) love Freya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Adrian Sierkowski Posted November 21, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 21, 2012 I don't think it's directors as much as Ad agency people who freak out without knowing exactly what they are getting. So goes my 2 cents at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Stephen Williams Posted November 21, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 21, 2012 What does that mean a 100% surcharge? Do you mean like minimum lab fees or something? Double the normal price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freya Black Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Double the normal price. I don't understand! They want you to wait a week and then charge you double? Sounds strange!? Is that because you are shooting so little (a lab minimum of some kind?) love Freya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freya Black Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I don't think it's directors as much as Ad agency people who freak out without knowing exactly what they are getting. So goes my 2 cents at least. Think that's silly. They should just pay attention to what is happening on set, and again, there is still a video tap. Yeah it will probably look different to the video tap, loads better specifically. Whereas on video it will look just like the video tap and why would you want that when you can have better! *shrug*. love Freya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Adrian Sierkowski Posted November 21, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 21, 2012 It is silly; but they are often silly people. I was once advised to always get the worst tap for ad clients so they can't make creative choices off of it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freya Black Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 It is silly; but they are often silly people. I was once advised to always get the worst tap for ad clients so they can't make creative choices off of it! I bet they have great presentation skills tho!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Adrian Sierkowski Posted November 21, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 21, 2012 I think the victory for that goes to the US army; who have jobs devoted entirely to power point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Stephen Williams Posted November 21, 2012 Premium Member Share Posted November 21, 2012 I don't understand! They want you to wait a week and then charge you double? Sounds strange!? Is that because you are shooting so little (a lab minimum of some kind?) love Freya Double lab minimum & processing the following morning at 8,00am Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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