Help with exposing Ektachrome 100D

[Valentin Iraola]

Hello everyone, a super 8 newbie here in Argentina. I'm writing because I've been shooting super 8 for the last 2 years, only negative film and i'm wanting to shoot some Ektachrome but I'm kinda afraid of how to expose properly. I have a Minolta XL-Sound 64. When I shoot negative film, I usually spot meter (with camera with calibrated meter) to the shadows and sometimes more towards the mid tones. But I know that Ektachrome does not forgive you any extra stop/s over or underexposed. I thought of three ways of exposing Ektachrome correctly (please correct me if i'm wrong):

- Simply spot metering the highlights.

- Spot metering the highlights and also the dark tones, and get an average exposure. (Is Ansel Adams Zone System good to know for exposing reversal film?)

- Matrix metering of the full scene

I also have a 18% grey card, I don't know if that would be helpful. I'm going on vacations to a place where usually it's very sunny (usually no clouds at all) and I thought Ektachrome should be my best option for these sunny days. 

Thank you very much!

[Patrick Cooper]

For years, I shot on Kodachrome 40 reversal film in super 8 and for the most part, the exposures turned out fine. I usually used the internal meter of my Canon 1014E and looked out for mid tones to take a light reading from. Kodachrome 40 is a very contrasty film stock so in high contrast scenes with both deep shadow and bright sunlight, I generally exposed for the brighter parts of the scene and let the shadows go black. I learned that the hard way with that particular film stock.

I would be very careful of what grey card you select. Make sure you do some tests with it beforehand. When I first got a grey card, my exposures turned out spot on (when I shooting on 35mm slide film.) Some time later, I got hold of another grey card from a different brand and used it for a few film shoots. This included slide film that turned out severely underexposed (very dark images.) And despite trying to overexpose 16mm negative film by half a stop, the 16mm still turned out underexposed - thanks to that damn grey card. This is the only time I have ever shot 16mm negative film and it happened to be Fuji Eterna 250D (which has long been discontinued.) That grey card did me no favours at all. A very bad purchase. I threw it out after that. 

By the way, I have shot 16mm reversal film a few times (both colour and B&W) and they turned out well in terms of exposure. For those films, I looked out for mid tones in the scene to take a light reading from (using a 35mm SLR.) This was a Canon T70 that had a partial metering mode (almost like a spot meter but not quite as small an area to take a reading.)

 

[Valentin Iraola]

17 minutes ago, Patrick Cooper said:

For years, I shot on Kodachrome 40 reversal film in super 8 and for the most part, the exposures turned out fine. I usually used the internal meter of my Canon 1014E and looked out for mid tones to take a light reading from. Kodachrome 40 is a very contrasty film stock so in high contrast scenes with both deep shadow and bright sunlight, I generally exposed for the brighter parts of the scene and let the shadows go black. I learned that the hard way with that particular film stock.

I would be very careful of what grey card you select. Make sure you do some tests with it beforehand. When I first got a grey card, my exposures turned out spot on (when I shooting on 35mm slide film.) Some time later, I got hold of another grey card from a different brand and used it for a few film shoots. This included slide film that turned out severely underexposed (very dark images.) And despite trying to overexpose 16mm negative film by half a stop, the 16mm still turned out underexposed - thanks to that damn grey card. This is the only time I have ever shot 16mm negative film and it happened to be Fuji Eterna 250D (which has long been discontinued.) That grey card did me no favours at all. A very bad purchase. I threw it out after that. 

By the way, I have shot 16mm reversal film a few times (both colour and B&W) and they turned out well in terms of exposure. For those films, I looked out for mid tones in the scene to take a light reading from (using a 35mm SLR.) This was a Canon T70 that had a partial metering mode (almost like a spot meter but not quite as small an area to take a reading.)

 

That’s good to know! So maybe I could spot meter the midtones and see what I can get. If it’s a very bright scene, with a reflective building for example, exposing for the midtones, Ektachrome will probably easily blow out the highlights no?

[Patrick Cooper]

I could visualise the highlights of a reflective building being blown out on a reversal film like Ektachrome if one is exposing for the mid tones.

Though Ive only shot a little bit of Ektachrome 100D years ago and I can't recall a lot from that film stock. 

Oh another handy tip for shooting reversal film is taking a light reading from green grass and then reducing the exposure a little. For example - closing down the aperture between a third of a stop and half a stop from the recommended reading. I once shooting slide film at a zoo (of a gorilla enclosure) and I took a reading from the green grass and then closed down half a stop from that. The exposures turned out perfect. 

Another thing that can be done is taking a reading from something that is white and then opening up two stops. Handy for shooting in dim or low light conditions where a light meter might struggle to get a reading from a mid tone. If you're doing this in bright, sunny conditions, take care with whatever white surface you're metering from (ie if it's very reflective.) If there's glare coming from the white surface, you might have to alter the angle otherwise you might end up with underexposure (despite opening up two stops.) 

Depending on what kind of environment you're shooting in, you could use a combination of these different methods and do a comparison. For example - taking a reading from a mid tone, taking another reading from green grass and closing down half a stop and then metering from a white surface and opening up two stops. If all these methods end up indicating the same aperture, then it's a pretty safe bet that that would be the correct aperture to use. 

 

 

 

[Sebastian Bock]

Hey Valentin!

Regardless of how and where you measure, always keep in mind, that your viewfinder system is stealing you approximately 2/3 stops of light. 
 

Other than that, I found the new Ektachrome 100D really forgiving. If you measure for the bright parts of your scene, you can easily open up 3 stops of your reading (to use the terminology of the Zone System: let it fall on Zone VIII). 
…and yes - you‘ve read carefully, if you now add „…you can easily open up 3 stops of your reading PLUS another 2/3 to compensate the loss of the cameras‘ viewfinder“. 
 

And to answer your question: Yes, if you are exposing (reversal) film with the help of a light meter, it is helpful to understand the basic concept of the Zone System. But you can skip the chapter where it comes to N- and N+ exposure and development as this was meant to be used to control the contrast of single sheet large format negatives. 
 

Edited July 8, 2024 by Sebastian Bock

[Valentin Iraola]

6 hours ago, Sebastian Bock said:

Hey Valentin!

Regardless of how and where you measure, always keep in mind, that your viewfinder system is stealing you approximately 2/3 stops of light. 
 

Other than that, I found the new Ektachrome 100D really forgiving. If you measure for the bright parts of your scene, you can easily open up 3 stops of your reading (to use the terminology of the Zone System: let it fall on Zone VIII). 
…and yes - you‘ve read carefully, if you now add „…you can easily open up 3 stops of your reading PLUS another 2/3 to compensate the loss of the cameras‘ viewfinder“. 
 

And to answer your question: Yes, if you are exposing (reversal) film with the help of a light meter, it is helpful to understand the basic concept of the Zone System. But you can skip the chapter where it comes to N- and N+ exposure and development as this was meant to be used to control the contrast of single sheet large format negatives. 
 

Awesome, thanks soo much for the info!

[Samuel Berger]

On 7/7/2024 at 9:10 PM, Patrick Cooper said:

When I first got a grey card, my exposures turned out spot on (when I shooting on 35mm slide film.)

It's been 30 years since I've shot slide film, and I'm about to do it again next month. How do you use a grey card with it?

[Karim D. Ghantous]

7 hours ago, Samuel Berger said:

It's been 30 years since I've shot slide film, and I'm about to do it again next month. How do you use a grey card with it?

I shot some Super-8 Ektachrome about ten years ago, and metered off what I considered to be a mid tone. I didn't use a grey card or an incident meter. Here are a couple of frames:

 

[Patrick Cooper]

8 hours ago, Samuel Berger said:

It's been 30 years since I've shot slide film, and I'm about to do it again next month. How do you use a grey card with it?

Place your meter fairly close to the grey card so that it's only metering the card and nothing else. If it's a sunny day, you may need to alter the angle of the card to avoid glare and reflections. If there are any glare or reflections on the card, this will likely influence the reading, resulting in underexposure.

With the second grey card that I purchased, I did alter the angle of the card to avoid glare etc but I was still getting severe underexposure with slide film (and with negative movie film.) So yea it might be wise to shoot a test film first with your particular grey card to see if it truly does reflect 18% of the light. Or perhaps do some tests with a digital camera and compare the readings with the meter that you'll be using with the film (with both the card and different subjects. )

 

[Patrick Cooper]

There is something that is kind of ironic. I have only shot two colour films in 16mm - one was reversal and the other was negative. The first one was reversal (with obviously narrow exposure latitude) mostly out in the snow and for that film, I metered off random neutral toned subjects that I found in the environment. The exposures were spot on.

With the colour negative film, I tried overexposing by half a stop and took great care in using my (second) grey card for all the shooting. The result? Underexposed footage. Unbelievable. 

For both films, I used the internal meter of my Canon T70 35mm SLR camera. 

 

 

[Patrick Cooper]

Oh another thing - make sure you pack away the grey card straight after using it. If it's left out in the sun, it's grey colour can fade over time - making it lighter. And of course this will lead to underexposure.

If you don't have enough time to perform a test, you could bracket your exposures. Alternatively, if your shoot takes place within a fairly short space of time and the light conditions are going to be constant and won't change, you could arrange for your lab to do a clip test. Ask your lab if they can indeed do a clip test before the shoot. That's where you take a few test shots at the beginning of the film with your estimated exposure. The lab will cut off a portion of the beginning of the film and process that and analyse the results. If the frames are correctly exposed. the rest of the film will be developed normally. However, if those first frames are overexposed or underexposed, the lab will adjust the development times accordingly for the rest of the film. If you go down this route, make sure you select a single exposure setting for the whole of the film.

The back of grey cars are usually white. This can be handy when taking light readings in low light conditions. Make sure you open up two stops from the recommended reading (from the white side.)