Quicktime hits rock bottom

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

Okay, this has gone about far enough.

 

I've recently been forced to download Quicktime 7 for Windows so as to be able to play back 1080p trailers from apple.com. This irks me, as it offers nothing I need over version 6, as the issue with HD trailers is one of ever-advancing rights protection, not technical ability. What's more, it comes with the now-standard quantity of worthless, irritating detritus:

 

- Installs inefficient and bloated software outside the remit of the package at hand? Check.

 

- Wants to "phone home" on install and every eighteen seconds thereafter, to tell The Man what you're doing? Check.

 

- Wants to steal all your filetypes to play in its own sluggish, inefficient interface? Check.

 

- Installs resource-hungry and unsightly systray icon with no clear option to remove it? Check.

 

As if this list of tiresomely-predictable sins weren't enough, they've fallen to removing features we've come to expect as standard and then hyping them as "pro" enhancements. It's been a while since Apple started ripping basic functionality out of Quicktime to create a visible differentiation between the basic and pro versions, but it's not my fault that they've destroyed the web-video mastering market by giving away the encoders for all their best codecs. If Quicktime was $20 to allow me to encode, I'd pay it. But it's not. It'll encode anyway, I just can't do basic functions with the free version. How the hell is this helpful to anyone in the market, Apple included?

 

This might be why I can't download movies to watch later. Quicktime wants me to download the 159Mb 1080p Aeon Flux trailer every time I want to watch it. That's not only time-consuming and unnecessary, it's going to chew up the internet and soak huge quantities of unnecessary bandwidth.

 

Why am I forced to install iTunes? I do not use iTunes and I never will until the UK version stops being such an outrageous ripoff and starts offering music in a format I can use. The more they try to force me to use it, the less inclined I will be to do so. At least with version 6 you could download the Windows 98 version of Quicktime and avoid this.

 

For what it's worth, you can easily download the HD trailers from apple.com by examining the source of the web page, downloading the linked referrer .mov and finding the URL string in a text editor, making it so easy to circumvent that this entire, ridiculous, timewasting, irritating charade is about as effective as duct-taping an honesty box to the front gates at Apple.

 

And do I get any concrete advantages out of the "pro" version? Do I get to avoid all the pointless graphical chrome and get a small, simple, efficient version of Quicktime which would actually be truly professional? Do I hell. I just get the version that does what anyone would expect it to do anyway. Come on, folks, this is a Microsoft trick. Professionals do not want applications that look like they were developed at the Ronald McDonald school of user interface design.

 

Apple - hey, guys, I've been tacitly promoting your previously-fine products for the best part of ten years by using them extensively in the distribution of digital video. I owned full versions of Quicktime 3-6. What'd I do? Why do you hate me?

 

Phil

[Trevor Greenfield]

I assume you've tried Quicktime Alternative?

 

http://www.codecguide.com/download_qt.htm

 

Allows you to play QT 7 in players such as VLC and Media Player Classic, without the need for installing Apple Quicktime.

 

I now use this and have stopped downloading Quicktime for exactly the reasons you mentioned. In the infancy of streaming video, I used RealPlayer a lot too, but Im glad it died because I hated all the AOL and bloated crap it installed. I too dont like players that phone home, or install bloatware, spyware or are adware (though Im usually tolerant of adware as long as its tasteful.

[Patrick Neary]

Here, add this to your list- I HAD Quicktime Pro, and when I upgraded, it effectively neutered my pro-version, and set me back to the non-pro, newer version, with a prompt to upgrade once again to the pro version for $29 or whatever they're charging...thanks fellas.

[Adam Frisch FSF]

QT might not be all there is, but it sure beats the hell out of the competition out there. WMP is horrendous - fails to play every time. Real Player has been sucking for 10 year already and is now hopefully dead.

I think it was Churchill who said about democrazy: "Out of all the bad ways to govern, democrazy is the least bad". That's exactly what I feel about QT.

 

VLC is a clever idea, but the reality is less appealing. VLC's controls are beyond bad - forget FF or Rewind without it jumping at least 1 minute ahead/back at a time (anyone who's tried to get frame grabs from a DVD in this player knows what I mean). I only use it for .avi files, because QT is crap at that.

 

Don't know what you're talking about not being able to download trailers to your desktop at apple.com - I can save every one. But maybe it's because I got Pro.

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

Yes, that's because you got Pro. But that's not a pro feature, that's a basic feature. Encoding H.264 is a pro feature, but the basic version lets you do that in all your favourite applications. How on earth does that possibly make sense?

 

It just makes Quicktime a generally irritating, crassly moneygrubbing experience to use. I think this is probably quite widely realised, too, because the only place I know of that insists on QT7 is apple.com itself.

 

Phil

[Tenolian Bell]

- Installs inefficient and bloated software outside the remit of the package at hand? Check.

 

- Wants to "phone home" on install and every eighteen seconds thereafter, to tell The Man what you're doing? Check.

 

- Wants to steal all your filetypes to play in its own sluggish, inefficient interface? Check.

 

- Installs resource-hungry and unsightly systray icon with no clear option to remove it? Check.

 

Yes all of that does suck.

 

I've heard similar complaints from other Windows users who download Quicktime.

 

Quicktime and iTunes are well integrated into OS X, so Mac users don't have much problem with them.

 

Perhaps part of the problem is Apple overzealous in drawing the massive number of Windows users toward Quicktime and iTunes. Which honestly has been successful with iTunes controlling about 75% of the music download market.

 

As far as the software phoning home. There is a feature in iTunes called the mini store that does look at what music you have to suggest more to buy. The Mac version of iTunes this feature can be turned off. There is no way for this feature to know if you have stolen music on your hardrive or not. In the Mac version of iTunes you can disable connection to the iTunes music store altogether. I'm sure these features should be the same on the Windows version of iTunes.

 

You don't have to buy music from the iTunes music store to use iTunes. 90% of the music in my iTunes and on my iPod have been ripped from my CD collection in the AIFF format. I've bought a few of singles from iTMS. Generally I just wanted that song and didn't want to buy the whole album.

 

As far as pro features vs basic features. It is possible to download movies with basic Quicktime from websites that allow them to be downloaded. As far as I know its only Apple's website that won't allow you to download without the Pro feature. I can agree with Phil that this does nickle and dime the consumer.

 

Full screen playback is the one I find confusing. Apple only allows full screen playback if you have Pro. I think that's nonesense. Fullscreen playback should be a basic feature.

 

I do have the Pro version Quicktime because I have Final Cut Pro which automatically gives you a Pro Quicktime license.

 

On the other hand the primary codecs used in Quicktime are open and not owned by Apple so you are free to choose an alternative media player. While Windows media codecs are proprietary and you have to use a Microsoft supported media player.

 

I HAD Quicktime Pro, and when I upgraded, it effectively neutered my pro-version,

 

This is true Quicktime 7.0.4 wiped out some Pro licenses. For Mac users that had the problem Apple provided away to revert back to QT 7.0.3. And provided no reprieve for Windows users, probably until the next update that fixes the bug.

 

I don't think that's right, but it does seem both Apple and Microsoft only do the minimum necessary to support cross platform media players.

 

To be fair though you have many options for encoding and decoding Quicktime's primay codecs, while you have few options for Windows Media Codec's.

[Jamie Metzger]

Jesus christ; how much memory can a tray Icon take up?

 

every program media wise asks you if you want that program to be the default player.

[Freya Black]

Jesus christ; how much memory can a tray Icon take up?

 

As much as it feels like, they are just apps.

 

I found you can get rid of the tray icon by going into the quicktime icon in control panel and looking under the advanced(!!!) tab.

 

I agree tho, since I installed the new quicktime, my computer slows to a crawl or sometimes completely freezes for a while as the quicktime movie starts up! It's been a horrible "upgrade".

 

You can uninstall itunes seperately from quicktime too thankfully! :) It was the first thing I did!

 

love

 

Freya

Edited February 27, 2006 by Freya

[Tim J Durham]

This might be why I can't download movies to watch later. Quicktime wants me to download the 159Mb 1080p Aeon Flux trailer every time I want to watch it. That's not only time-consuming and unnecessary, it's going to chew up the internet and soak huge quantities of unnecessary bandwidth.

 

Ummmm.....

 

WHY you'd be wanting to view that trailer more than once is the question you should be asking yourself.

 

Also, I suspect there are legal issues involved with you saving those trailers so they limit that from happening.

Apple has been playing nice-nice with the movie and music industries so...

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

As loath as I am to talk up Microsoft, there are free versions of Windows Media Encoder. Not that anyone should be using it - there's vastly better H.264 encoders available (of which Quicktime is sadly not the best).

 

Fullscreen? Hell yes. Forgot to mention that irritating little nonfeature.

 

Unfortunately the performance of Quicktime Alternative is pretty appalling. It won't even play back the standard web-resolution stuff properly, let alone HD

 

The Linux-originated program mplayer slays them all for performance, especially skip and seek performance, and generally being fast and tiny and efficient. Of course that comes with the usual amount of Linux-style commandline bashing. Also, it doesn't play back 1080p H.264 Quicktime very well.

 

Editors tend to have a deep-seated distrust of systray icons. They have a nasty habit of popping up a box which says "Hello! I'm PointlessWidget 1.0! Would you like upgrade to PointlessWidget 1.0 PRO XL ULTIMATE EDITION for a one-time payment of $9.99? (US Mainland Residents Only). Click OK to send every text file on the machine to WidgetCorp for their later perusal and distribution to every spam centre in South America!" This is loathsome enough, let alone when it does it 89 minutes into a 90-minute VT export.

 

There are no legal issues as they let you do it with Pro.

 

Why did I want to watch it? I do have an excuse; the only thing I liked about the movie was a tiny detail of costume design (no, not THAT costume...). Apparently there's a featurette on the costume design on the recently-release US DVD, which I'd like to get hold of.

 

Phil

[Tim J Durham]

There are no legal issues as they let you do it with Pro.

 

Phil

 

But to get Pro, you've submitted credit info so they know you're registering as a real person. Anyone can download a free player without using their real identity info. No?

[Tim Tyler]

Why am I forced to install iTunes?

 

You can download the iTunesLess version at http://www.apple.com/quicktime/download/standalone.html

 

When installing, carefully opt to not give Quicktime file type associations outside of MOV's.

 

After install, rename the 'qttask.exe' file in the Quicktime directory to eliminate an unnecessary background process.

[Tenolian Bell]

Yeah I don't think Apple intends for Quicktime to be equally competative with all encoders. I mostly use it to shrink movies for the internet, e-mail, and more recently to put on my iPod.

 

Compressor is a better encoder than Quicktime. The problem is that there are so many variables and options in Compressor it takes a bit of trial and error to find the right combination of compression, data rate and file size. While Quicktime has only a few choices that are easy to use.

 

If I'm making something small for the internet, Quicktime seems fine to me.

 

When I want to shrink the data size of a movie that is expected to play at full screen, or encoding for a DVD, Compressor of course is much better.

 

Also for saving movies from the internet. I mostly use Snapz Pro X which records anything on your monitor and saves it as a Quicktime movie. Seeing as Windows has thousands of applications there should be an equivalent.

[Landon D. Parks]

Myself, I have never had any problem with Quicktime. I play 1080p trailers from apples site on my PC all the time, and I have yet to experiance bad computer performance (other than trying to play 1080 on a computer not really set up to take it, so thats not apples fault).

 

The only program I ever knew Quicktime installed was itunes, and thats nothing.

 

I find it hard to beleive Quicktime from apple installs adware and spyware... As It has never happend to me.

 

Plus, I think quicktime movies look better than most other file formats... Generally, all WMV stuff I download is overly compressed and laking in many things, including color and contrast. Every trailer I download in quicktime (.mov) format is clean, crisp.. Has great color, sound, ect...

 

IF you are having troubkle like I use to have with Itunes starting up everytime my computer does, simply:

 

click "start", click "run", type in "MSCONFIG" and press enter, click on the "startup" tab and uncheck "Quicktime" and "Itunes" both... They will still load when you need them, just not when you don't.

 

Just my $0.02

[Josh Bass]

That's not entirely true. I've had things that I've "msconfigged" out of my startup reinsert themselves. QT is a big violator in that area. It seems like if you take it out of your startup, the next time you use the player, it reintegrates itself, so the next time you start up, BAM there it is.

[Stuart Brereton]

Compressor is a better encoder than Quicktime.

 

Maybe, but it's slower than continental drift!

[Landon D. Parks]

That's not entirely true. I've had things that I've "msconfigged" out of my startup reinsert themselves. QT is a big violator in that area. It seems like if you take it out of your startup, the next time you use the player, it reintegrates itself, so the next time you start up, BAM there it is.

 

Well, you have to do more than just romove it from startup... you also have to go into the preferences in QT and unselect "Load at windows startup"... because if you leave this checked, the next time you open the player, it will automaticly override the system and start QT anyway.

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

This is true.

 

It might be easier to rename the executable, but that will cause an error to be placed in the system event log on every boot.

 

Phil

[Michael Nash]

Just adding to the fray...

 

I recently upgraded to an Itel core duo imac 20", and with DSL I've finally caught up to the 21st century in trailer viewing.

 

The DOWNSIDE -- not everything is compatible with the new chip, and WMV in particular. It works, sort of, but playback is essentially crap. And the plugin to view WMV source in a web page doesn't work yet at all.

 

But, there are always a few bugs with new generation gear. FWIW I'm loving quicktime and can't wait until Apple releases the new version of FCP Studio that works with the new chip.

[Tenolian Bell]

The iMac is a really nice hardware.

 

You are right most PowerPC native software will run slow on your Intel iMac and some of it won't run at all.

 

The good part however the Intel native applications you do have are running just as fast and in some cases slightly faster than my dual G5.

 

Final Cut Studio is expected to be Intel native at NAB 2006.

 

Adobe Creative Suite is expected in either late 2006 to early 2007.

 

By the end of this year most Mac applications should be Intel native.

[Tenolian Bell]

An article I've just seen that is apropos to Phil's complaints.

 

http://www.websiteoptimization.com/bw/0603/

 

The article speaks about iTunes phenomenal adoption and user rate. In three years iTunes has gone from zero to 18.5 million unique users in the US.

 

The article states that in the US people who use iTunes on average use it twice as long as users of Windows Media Player or RealPlayer.

 

At its current growth rate iTunes will over take RealPlayer with over 30 million unique users and only second behind Windows Media Player with 71 million users.

 

The article also points that most iTunes users choose to download iTunes in contrast with Windows Media Player which comes bundled with nearly all Windows systems.

 

The article separates iTunes and Quicktime use. But in reality both are tied together.

 

 

I can see how annoying iTunes and Quicktime can be to a Windows user if they only want Quicktime and not iTunes.

 

But from a business perspective and consumer electronics as a whole this is proving to be a winning strategy for Apple.

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

That sort of corporate number crunching is best taken with a pinch of salt. Define "itunes user" - someone who's been force-fed it along with Quicktime?

 

Phil

[Tenolian Bell]

These aren't Apple numbers they come from Nielson. Nielson is the same company that measures broadcast network audiences and determines how much advertisers pay for commercial time.

 

The point is to be agnostic and free from bias to anyone. Unless you have some information to the contrary.

 

From the Nielson numbers for the past three years Quicktime downloads have been going down while iTunes numbers are dramatically going up. So actually its the other way around. Quicktime is being force-fed to those who want iTunes.

 

But then iTunes isn't fully functional without Quicktime.

[Tenolian Bell]

Compressor is a better encoder than Quicktime.

 

Maybe, but it's slower than continental drift!

 

The better encoders will make multiple passes over video. Analyzing motion and detail to decide where to best add the most compression.

 

Quicktime to the best of my knowledge only makes one pass over video which isn't as efficient for file size vs. compression artifacts.

[Tenolian Bell]

After looking it up Quicktime does use a 2 pass system.