Matthew Buick Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 I've heard of a processing process where the Silver Halide Crystals are left in the film indtead of being bleached out. What is this process called? And what does it do to the image? Best Regards, Matthew A. Buick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K Borowski Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 It's called bleach bypass Matthew. I've never done it with movie films, but it's essentially the same thing that happens if you stop and fix color photopaper instead of bleaching the silver out. Contrast is heightened, shadow detail is lost, and the retained silver creates a much denser black and a desaturated color look, as the negative's dyes are physically located in close proximity to the grain. Coupled with blue filtration and push processing to further accentuate grain, is the superb "Minority Report"; if you want to actually observe the effects of this process then rent it out or watch it on HDTV. Regards, ~Karl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Buick Posted February 7, 2007 Author Share Posted February 7, 2007 Excellent, I'll certainly need it, methinks. Good luck. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted February 8, 2007 Premium Member Share Posted February 8, 2007 Most labs charge a $500 set-up fee for bleach-bypass processing, plus a per-foot charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhavin Amin Posted February 8, 2007 Share Posted February 8, 2007 Spielberg's DP, Janus Kaminski uses it alot especially in Saving Private Ryan and Munich. I heard it can be done digitally as well, would it be cheaper? And would it look the same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted February 8, 2007 Premium Member Share Posted February 8, 2007 Spielberg's DP, Janus Kaminski uses it alot especially in Saving Private Ryan and Munich. I heard it can be done digitally as well, would it be cheaper? And would it look the same? Depends on what you mean by cheaper -- if you were doing digital transfer and color-correction anyway, then doing a simulated skip-bleach look is not difficult and doesn't cost you more money. But it's not exactly the same since leaving silver in adds a unique grain texture from the silver grains. But if you were shooting a feature and doing a photochemical finish, then using a D.I. instead just to get a skip-bleach look would certainly be more expensive than skip-bleaching the film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Sponsor Robert Houllahan Posted February 8, 2007 Site Sponsor Share Posted February 8, 2007 Don't let that negative, skip bleach, sit too long either it will change over time! you can bleach it later on though. 500.00? we are going to have to raise our prices! :D -Rob- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Buick Posted February 8, 2007 Author Share Posted February 8, 2007 Most labs charge a $500 set-up fee for bleach-bypass processing, plus a per-foot charge. Oh, crumbs! <_< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason M Silverman Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 Can this process be done on all film, 16mm and 8mm included? I assume few if any labs would do it for 8mm? Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted February 12, 2007 Premium Member Share Posted February 12, 2007 Can this process be done on all film, 16mm and 8mm included? I assume few if any labs would do it for 8mm? All color film -- b&w is only made up of silver to begin with. I'm not sure how or where skip-bleach works in the color reversal processing chain though. I doubt a Super-8 lab would bother to offer such an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davon Slininger Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 All color film -- b&w is only made up of silver to begin with. I'm not sure how or where skip-bleach works in the color reversal processing chain though. I doubt a Super-8 lab would bother to offer such an option. I was just browsing the Pro8mm website. They are a 8mm and 16mm specialty lab and retailer in Burbank, CA. They offer skip bleach processing on both 8mm and 16mm stocks. They will also convert any current 35mm stock to Super8. www.pro8mm.com Pretty awesome actually. A niche market i guess, in an age of ever increasing digital reproduction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K Borowski Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 For $500 a setup, I'd probably try doing bleach bypass myself if I only needed to do it in selected scenes. Essentially, it's the same as your standard ECN-II process but without the bleach, and I'd personally want extended fix and wash times to make sure no silver halides are left in and that the residual fixer left in the film emulsion will not be of sufficiently high amounts to cause fading of the silver grains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Buick Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 How hard would that be to do? I'm thinking I may need that distinct look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted February 13, 2007 Premium Member Share Posted February 13, 2007 How hard would that be to do? Too hard for me... I had a hard enough time in my darkroom class in college winding the film onto the spindle for the processing tank without pinching it, let alone keeping things clean enough. I had endless dirt & dust problems with my b&w still photography. Now compound that with the tiny Super-8 frame and imagine how big a speck of dust can look. Even I'm not anal-retentive enough to do my own (clean) lab work... This brings up another issue entirely, which is the obsession beginners have with non-standardized processes and techniques, before they've even mastered the standard filmmaking practices. I get emails and see posts all the time from students who have barely shot 100' for movie film in their lives asking for advice because they want to skip-bleach, cross-process, and flash their film, sometimes not even knowing what those terms even mean yet! Don't get hung up on specialized techniques; they can be a distraction from learning the meat and potatoes of filmmaking, the general skills that you will always need. Even now that I'm working on films with a budget, I have to ask myself if insisting that some odd (and more expensive) technique be used whether I'm being more artistic... or just jerking off. Sometimes using a simpler technique like a camera filter or a different film stock is enough of a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Buick Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 Right, my mind's made up, I'm not doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Burke Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 All color film -- b&w is only made up of silver to begin with. I'm not sure how or where skip-bleach works in the color reversal processing chain though. I doubt a Super-8 lab would bother to offer such an option. Cinelab offers skip bleach and cross process for Super 8. Better get your oder in before Rob raises his prices. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Site Sponsor Robert Houllahan Posted February 13, 2007 Site Sponsor Share Posted February 13, 2007 Cinelab offers skip bleach and cross process for Super 8. Better get your oder in before Rob raises his prices.Chris yes we do, I was kidding about raising the prices.... :D -Rob- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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