Salil Sundresh Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 Anyone have any experience with Impact's Grip heads? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/3719..._Head_2_5_.html Would save $11 over the Matthews grip heads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD Hartman Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 B&H listing doesn't say much. Where are they cast? And cast from what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve London Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Anyone have any experience with Impact's Grip heads?http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/3719..._Head_2_5_.html Would save $11 over the Matthews grip heads I don't know. I love these guys at $24.50 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/3581...Grip_Head_.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD Hartman Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Your right, the Avenger/Manfrotto grip heads aren't a bad price. It makes me laugh, when I see people bidding 20 or 25 dollars (USD) for used ones (Mole, Matthews, Norms, etc.) on Ebay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Tyler Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Be careful with cheap grip gear. I've seen the metal crumble and crack on some of the Amvona stands and grip fixtures you see on eBay. The day a fixture or grip rig falls on someone's head will be the day you regret trying to save a few dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanjay Sami Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 Be careful with cheap grip gear. Thats great advice. Though it has to be said that a lot of film equipment is expensive for no apparent reason. The Avenger grip head is really good. I use them a lot, though I have to pay 55$ for them in India because of crazy duties and an unscrupulous dealer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Tyler Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 a lot of film equipment is expensive for no apparent reason. An expensive piece of (film) equipment's cost may not be apparent, but it's usually justified. That's the case with products manufactured for a specialized market. If Avenger and Matthews could expect to sell cases of grip heads to millions of customers they would likely manufacture in larger quantities to reduce cost. If grip heads weren't routinely tossed around like softballs and were not expected to secure a $60,000 camera to the top of a moving car, maybe they would use less expensive metals and manufacturing methods to make them. A quality grip head you buy today can be expected to do its job everyday for the next 30 years without a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanjay Sami Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 but it's usually justified. That's the case with products manufactured for a specialized market. no argument there. I dont think 25$ is too much for a griphead, though I think a lot of film equipment is overpriced. I understand that some equipment needs to be priced high in order to ammortise small manufacturing numbers. The high cost is not due to the use of exotic materials, but more for the lack of volume. Having said all of this, I would never use a griphead to secure a camera on a moving car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Tyler Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Having said all of this, I would never use a griphead to secure a camera on a moving car. Not just a grip head, but car rigs are often secured with multiple arms, heads, and suction cups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Wallens Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 (edited) Not just a grip head, but car rigs are often secured with multiple arms, heads, and suction cups. Well, not really. REAL car rigs are secured with ratchet straps, speed rail, and rail starters. ;) (honestly, I try to stay away from anything with suction cups) Edited February 14, 2009 by Daniel Wallens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Wallens Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 And YES, a lot of film equipment is grossly overpriced, as any technician who's been around the equipment long enough knows. An oconner frontbox is DEFINITELY not worth 300+ dollars, by measure of materials used, construction, design, or any other stretch of the imagination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanjay Sami Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Not just a grip head, but car rigs are often secured with multiple arms, heads, and suction cups. Hi Tim, I guess each to his own. Personally, I would not use grip heads on suction cups to secure cameras. Maybe Handycam type cameras but not movie cameras. Heres how I normally do it: http://www.thegripworks.com/rigging.html Regards Sanjay Sami www.thegripworks.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warwick Hempleman Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 I used to have a motorized suction cup system for rigging that was a nice tool. Each cup (I had some single and some double limpet) had a small motorized pump attached to it that would keep the vacuum. They ran on 12v DC and could be powered from the vehicle's cigarette lighter or battery or a camera battery. The power could be run through each unit to the next. Clamps on top took 3/4" tubing for the rig itself. Straps of course finished it all off, but the motors on the clamps cut out the "plate spinning" part of working with them. One of the biggest downside to suction cups of course is that their reliability is contingent on the quality of the paint job on the vehicle. A friend of mine in Munich still builds this sort of system on request, and has made it extremely low profile as well. But we digress. The stuff costs what it costs. If a manufacturer is essentially copying a product already designed, developed and brought to market by somebody else, of course they can offer it a little cheaper. There have also been some stunning changes in the price of raw materials in the past five years, which often happen faster then a manufacturer wants to or even dares adjust his pricing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Tyler Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Cameras and lights are secured with grip heads and arms on car rigs, not entirely supported from grip heads and arms. They add stability and help prevent vibration. It's typical to use a clamp on the mag or camera handle and route that with heads and arms to the support rig. Here's what I mean: http://www.ptgrey.com/newsletters/images/movia2.jpg http://www.ubms.biz/images/upload/CAMERA-SUPPORT-CARRIGS.jpg http://carsmedia.ign.com/cars/image/articl...23050512632.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Bass Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Speaking from personal experience, the Amvona stuff is crap. Someone said they were good stands, so I bought one. Firstly, yes, it was sent to me with a crack already in the one of the metal pieces that secures one of the legs to the column. When I got a replacement, they did something weird where I was sent two of the exact same piece and missing a piece I needed. I now had two bases for this C stand, neither of which was functional for one reason or another. By swapping pieces between them, I finally had a working base. The grip arm and head was always crap. . .even when brand new, would not hold tension no matter how hard you tightened it. Bad design, I guess. I bought the Avenger head/arm, kept the Amvona stand. And yes, whatever that darker grey metal is on these stands, it's some kind of weird, fake-seeming metal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanjay Sami Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 Speaking from personal experience, the Amvona stuff is crap. Someone said they were good stands, so I bought one. Firstly, yes, it was sent to me with a crack already in the one of the metal pieces that secures one of the legs to the column. When I got a replacement, they did something weird where I was sent two of the exact same piece and missing a piece I needed. I now had two bases for this C stand, neither of which was functional for one reason or another. By swapping pieces between them, I finally had a working base. The grip arm and head was always crap. . .even when brand new, would not hold tension no matter how hard you tightened it. Bad design, I guess. I bought the Avenger head/arm, kept the Amvona stand. And yes, whatever that darker grey metal is on these stands, it's some kind of weird, fake-seeming metal. It sounds very typically like a knock off. The darker colour is very often the result of poor quality aluminium being discoloured by the sand casting process. These fittings, both on the grip head as well as the stand are pressure die cast. When someone makes a knock off by using an original as a template to sand cast, it will wind up being very brittle. Sand casting requires more material (and therefore chunkier design) than pressure die casting, so they should not be the same size. Also they have probably left out 2 very small but important parts of the grip head. The first is the thrust washer/spacer that should have the curvature of the insde part of the griphead hub that it seats into. This allows greater distribution of force, with minimal friction. The other is the bearing, which allows the torque generated by you twisting the knob to be converted into pressure rather than be lost as friction. Sanjay Sami Key Grip www.thegripworks.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert duke Posted February 15, 2009 Share Posted February 15, 2009 It sounds very typically like a knock off. The darker colour is very often the result of poor quality aluminium being discoloured by the sand casting process. These fittings, both on the grip head as well as the stand are pressure die cast. When someone makes a knock off by using an original as a template to sand cast, it will wind up being very brittle. Sand casting requires more material (and therefore chunkier design) than pressure die casting, so they should not be the same size. Also they have probably left out 2 very small but important parts of the grip head. The first is the thrust washer/spacer that should have the curvature of the insde part of the griphead hub that it seats into. This allows greater distribution of force, with minimal friction. The other is the bearing, which allows the torque generated by you twisting the knob to be converted into pressure rather than be lost as friction. Sanjay Sami Key Grip www.thegripworks.com I recently worked with the AMOVONA stuff. Setting a flag I broke the plate of a head! I know that as a grip I TIGHTEN and can be forceful, but in almost twenty years I have NEVER broke a head like that with a 2x3. That being said the AMVONA , and JTL stuff is total crap, I wouldnt encourage these manufacturers to stay in buisness. That said I know that the Impact stuff is different than AMVONA, JTL and others. The IMPACT stuff is KUPO, I believe. Sanjay you should be familiar with KUPO. I believe they are Bollywood based. The Kupo stuff is good from looking at it. I tried get a distributorship from them a couple years ago. I know a couple of larger manufacturers are reselling their stuff under their name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanjay Sami Posted February 17, 2009 Share Posted February 17, 2009 That said I know that the Impact stuff is different than AMVONA, JTL and others. The IMPACT stuff is KUPO, I believe. Sanjay you should be familiar with KUPO. I believe they are Bollywood based. The Kupo stuff is good from looking at it. I tried get a distributorship from them a couple years ago. I know a couple of larger manufacturers are reselling their stuff under their name. Hi Robert, The Kupo Gripheads and stands are very good, but not made in India. They are actually made in Taiwan. They have a lot of products which are copies of originals like Cardellinis, but with a slight change , i'm guessing for patent reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salil Sundresh Posted February 22, 2009 Author Share Posted February 22, 2009 Well I took the plunge and ordered 3 of these and they arrived last week. So far so good, they feel solid and lock smoothly. I haven't used them to support much more than foamcore and silks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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