Johanan Pandone Posted January 10, 2023 Share Posted January 10, 2023 Hey guys, back with more lens questions.... Extreme Close-ups... How high of a reproduction ratio is needed to achieve the type of ECU's that Darren Aronofsky used heavily in Requiem? I understand the following principles: -working distance is GOOD, more room for lighting without casting a shadow on the subject. -Stopping down is GOOD, more depth of field, especially at close focus I'm having a hard time choosing between the following 3 lenses: Micro Nikkor AI(s) 105mmF4 - Pros: cheap, matches the rest of my kit, long focus throw, reported to be the sharpest of the 3 with the least amount of distortion Cons: maximum reproduction ratio of 1:2, slowest max aperture Micro Nikkor AI(s) 105mm F2.8 - Pros: same focus throw, matches the rest of my kit , 1 stop faster (but would I really need the additional speed since I'm stopping down for DOF?) Cons: more expensive, same max. reproduction 1:2 Micro Nikkor 105mm 2.8 AF Pros: Maximum reproduction 1:1 Cons: most expensive, coatings may not match as well, inferior build quality, Shorter focus throw First of all, I'm not shooting insects and flowers, I need this lens for extreme closeups, but not necessarily Macro work (in the traditional sense) I also don't need the lens to double as a fast 105mm lens for general use. As always your thoughts are greatly appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johanan Pandone Posted January 10, 2023 Author Share Posted January 10, 2023 eh... scored an incredible deal on the micro nikkor 105mm 2.8 AIS today. Couldn't say no. Only time will tell if I'm kicking myself for missing the 1:1 reproduction ratio of the AF version. I'll be picking up a 50mm extension tube that will bring it to 1:1 repro. I am still interested in your opinions regarding the decision I made. I am so happy with the other Nikkor ai(s) lenses in my kit I can't imagine being disappointed with this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Duncan Brown Posted January 10, 2023 Premium Member Share Posted January 10, 2023 You might consider a macro bellows if you really want to get close! I've done a lot of stills work with the Canon FD 50mm and 100mm macro lenses, and you can definitely get close... but if you want to get microscopic, it's time to break out the bellows. You can extend any lens with one, but you'll be far happier with an actual macro lens for its flat field, etc. Duncan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Dunn Posted January 11, 2023 Share Posted January 11, 2023 (edited) The extension tube will cost you light, but good macro lenses (and Micro-Nikkors qualify!) are so eye-bleeding sharp edge-to-edge, even wide open, that you may be able to shoot 1:2 and crop in post. This will help with your DoF. Incidentally the quality tends to go off a cliff smaller than f11 or 16. And I'm only talking about a Tamron 90mm. My Best. Glass. Ever. Fly's eye sharp. Edited January 11, 2023 by Mark Dunn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johanan Pandone Posted January 12, 2023 Author Share Posted January 12, 2023 On 1/10/2023 at 6:54 PM, Duncan Brown said: You might consider a macro bellows if you really want to get close! I've done a lot of stills work with the Canon FD 50mm and 100mm macro lenses, and you can definitely get close... but if you want to get microscopic, it's time to break out the bellows. You can extend any lens with one, but you'll be far happier with an actual macro lens for its flat field, etc. Duncan You're right, the original 105 goes up to 5:1 reproduction with bellows. How the heck would you light for that!? (The front element would be 2 inches from subject) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johanan Pandone Posted January 12, 2023 Author Share Posted January 12, 2023 9 hours ago, Mark Dunn said: The extension tube will cost you light, but good macro lenses (and Micro-Nikkors qualify!) are so eye-bleeding sharp edge-to-edge, even wide open, that you may be able to shoot 1:2 and crop in post. This will help with your DoF. Incidentally the quality tends to go off a cliff smaller than f11 or 16. And I'm only talking about a Tamron 90mm. My Best. Glass. Ever. Fly's eye sharp. You bring up a good point about light loss, I've read that even without the tube there is up to 1.5stops loss at close focus. I'm glad I ended up with the faster version, I probably end up using it for more than just macro, always nice to have a 2.8 in the 100mm range. I've not seen much from the tamron, didn't really come up in my research. There was a lot of praise for the tokina 105 macro though. Re: cropping- its awesome times we're living in when you have enough pixels to punch in (in post) Have you ever paired your tamron with a 2x teleconverter to gain working distance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Duncan Brown Posted January 12, 2023 Premium Member Share Posted January 12, 2023 59 minutes ago, Johanan Pandone said: You're right, the original 105 goes up to 5:1 reproduction with bellows. How the heck would you light for that!? (The front element would be 2 inches from subject) Ring light? Side light from every possible angle? Backlight, if your subject is translucent? There's always an answer if you're desperate enough. Duncan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johanan Pandone Posted January 12, 2023 Author Share Posted January 12, 2023 6 minutes ago, Duncan Brown said: Ring light? Side light from every possible angle? Backlight, if your subject is translucent? There's always an answer if you're desperate enough. Duncan Ring light might be okay for flat frontal fill, but Idk how you would acheive any sort of shape or modeling, have you ever seen those LED flashlights tha are very focusable? They have something like a projector lens in them? I am toying with the idea of picking up a few of those so I could create dimension on a tiny scale. I'm sure the color rendition on them is goofy, but if I balance for those and find some combination of gels to throw on whatever fixture(s) I'm using for the background It might work! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Dunn Posted January 12, 2023 Share Posted January 12, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, Johanan Pandone said: Have you ever paired your tamron with a 2x teleconverter to gain working distance? No, it's not something I would ever need for stills, which is what it was bought for, just offering a few thoughts since I acquired a macro lens. I'm sure Nikkors are at least as good as Tamron, they should be at the price! A teleconverter costs you some loss of quality, so you may be no worse off cropping in as an alternative. There have been tests that seem to support this. That eyeball ECU seems to be no more than 1:2. As you've found out, a macro lens at full extension is effectively an extension tube. Anyway as I always say, when you've alread bought something, stop looking at the alternatives, it's better for the nerves. Edited January 12, 2023 by Mark Dunn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johanan Pandone Posted January 12, 2023 Author Share Posted January 12, 2023 44 minutes ago, Mark Dunn said: Anyway as I always say, when you've alread bought something, stop looking at the alternatives, it's better for the nerves. I will take this advice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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