Albion Hockney

I made a post about IR ND right below this and Satsuki brought up the formatt Firecrest ND series. The reviews look very good

thanks much. the Firecrests look great from the reviews and very affordable. True ND's seem like the ones to really use but yes expensive. look forward to the day all cameras have internal ND or a better way of dealing with this!

And can you stack IR ND's or are you only supposed to use one IR ND and then standard NDs under that?

1. With tiffen filters what is the difference between the ir nd filters and the hot mirror ir nd filters? 2. With tiffen filters how do you use the non nd stand alone hot mirror filter. Is it effective to get standard nd filters and just place the hot mirror infront of them ? What strengths of ir nd work best with the hot mirror or does it work in such a way that it doesn't matter? 3. Does anyone use Schneider platinums with the red mx sensor and what do they think? I have seen tests and the footage that comes back looks super green I feel it must be losing Atleast some color information no? Is there an overall preference between Schneider platinums, tiffen hot mirror nds, and tiffen standard ir nds? Thanks for any insight, I know there are a lot of topics about these filters and no clear answers it seems.

Satsuki don't most shoot like this on the highend incorporate some kinda laser focus assist system? I've never used it but I always assume that double barreled little thing on top of the camera placed right above the sensor was for that.

I think its important to have even balance on the camera. If you can get an external LCD and get the camera body on your shoulder. if you can't do that use counter waits on the back of some rods. The camera should be balanced just like a tripod head so it can almost rest on your shoulder without going backward or forward. Also as noted the easy rig is great. All kinds of manufacturers make stuff and everyone uses different stuff. Wooden camera, Shape, Vocas to name a few third party camera accessories companies. but there is many more of varying quality. Stuff is pretty expensive though if your not used to this kinda niche equipment the small runs make the machined pieces not cheap.

Yea for your reference I think the color is on point, but that reference feels like it has less exposure and the source is less directional/softer

I don't think the DP's role is defined but it would be very hard to bother direct and DP a movie. The DP is in charge of lighting and that takes time on set where the director has a million other things to worry about (talking with all the other departments....reviewing the dialog, rehearsing the actors) that said it can be done. Reed Morano just directed and DP'd a film I'd read an interview about that to get a sense of what it would be like, she designed her film in a way to make it work though. When you see a movie....lets take the Godfather, the director in this case Coppola is in charge of the overall vision of the film....he might know for example it should be dark (im sure he would say something more complex....but for the sake of the example...) the DP on the movie Gordon Willis will literally take Coppolas words and ideas and turn it into a literal picture. for example in God Father Gordon Willis used a specific style of soft top light to create the iconic look you see on marlon brando ....Copploa might have know Every film is different for example some Directors shot list with the DP and others do a shot list themselves. On the day some directors place the camera and suggest focal lengths for the lenses and other directors let the DP do that alone. Often it is a collaboration though ....sometimes a DP will suggest a different way to block a scene or even be given notes on performance to the director.

I think the color is fine, looks twilight to me, I would leave subtle color shift up to post.Personally I only use stuff other then the standard color correction gels if i'm doing heavy color like red from a break light or sodium vapor light. that said I think it could feel a bit more full and twilight like with more work to the lighting and additional control. the simple soft key feels a bit too straight forward. I would have tried to maybe control the fall of on the background a little more and brought out some 4x4 nets to work it on her a little too. I probably would have also had the source come from higher up as if it is the sky coming through windows. and then you'd get a more interesting cut on the background as well. the thing about twilight is it is also dark. I think your close but I'd probably push it a little farther. the brightest parts of the frame maybe at stop or 1 stop under even. and have her face maybe 2 stops down.

there is "heat shield" which is a thin clear gel almost like cellophane. as said it only diverts the heat so its good to protect things for example if you have a large light near a window you often use it to stop the light from getting to hot and breaking the glass.

Silks are pretty beat, they just kinda fill in around the shadow and keep shadow lines in tact. I'm sure somtimes there is a specfic use for them but generally diff is your friend. Arri has a photo metric calcuator you can check out (just google arri photometric) and you can get an idea of what stop you get at that distance. 250 cuts about 1 stop of light and 216 cuts close to 2 stops of light. I'd guess at 30ft away through 250 you'd be at something like a 2.8/4 at 800

super interested, could be used to great effect I think.

ah so wendy lights were just before people were using par 64's? I thought it was just the same as a Dino

Yea agreed. Its for sure just outside of frame looks too big to just be a kino through 4x to me though.

probably muscos.

^ i donno about that acutally. in terms of cinema lighting the practice of diffusion was not common till atleast the 60's there is an example during the filming of the igmar bergman movie winter light (1962) and the cinematographer sven nykist is using Wax paper for diffusion as no material and frames have yet been invented for the purpose. in early filmmaking the stocks and lenses were soft, often it was beleived you needed to create sharpenss with hard contrast. there was sometimes diffusion added to lenses for women and beauty but that is about it.

I said prob a book light just because of the wrapping quality and the fall off in the background. Could be a big frame with something like full grid too feels like a book light with neg fill or nothing on the other side though too me. just a guess.

I think one key thing is just to nail the exposure levels. Our eyes see so differently then cameras in low light situations I think people have trouble translating it for the camera. I almost always find I need to underexpose more then I'm comfortable with, that is while keeping some marginal exposure in darks areas of the frame. something like your keylight being 2 stops under and then working in the 3-5 stop range for things you want to keep a marginal exposure on. if there is something bright in frame it needs to be contained and it needs to have a really great motivation like for example deakins with the car lights coming through the windows in no country.

haven't seen the film but looking like just a very soft side key. Probably a book light.

Thanks satsuki yea that sounds about right. Union rate cards arn't online and I think the rates go above that alot.

Interesting to hear everyone on this. Adrian that is amazing you go out so much!

I was just curious on well paid commerical how high do OP rates go? What is a good range for operator rates on national commerical spots or high end branded content....this would be stuff with 6 figure or higher budgets with well established directors from notable production companies. In most cases for an operator doing handheld work.

I think you should talk with the director about what your approach will be to the film and then talk the producer about attaining that. I wouldn't worry about the specfic numbers atleast upfront so much, that is not your job. on budget that low it can be really variable, depends on how ambitious the project is and if people are getting paid at all.

Light fall off can be calculated using photometrics at different distances....See what the difference in stop would be from the distant to the window and then to the back wall of the room your shooting in. Keep in mind the sun is 100million miles away and has no fall off ....unless its hitting curtains or some sorta diffusion it will be as bright on one side of a room as another if direct, so if you are trying mimic it realistically you just always want the biggest source as far away as you can. Not sure what you mean about the DP doesnt want "nice fall off" I donno if there is nice or not nice fall off but as said if you are going after the look of the sun you don't want it falling off much. In regards to HMI, David seems to prefer Tungsten for the color of the light and I beleive in other posts has stated he likes the tungsten heads because since sunset is near 3200k he can use them bare without any gel frames infront of them and therefore sometimes sneak them into frame if shooting back toward a window without seeing a gel frame. The downside of HMI's for some is color temp....sometimes they can be slightly off ....especially if they are older heads. As far as quality of light and diffusion its not really about the source being HMI or Tungsten. If you want the same look as a Tungsten Fresenel then you just need an HMI Fresenel. Par Lights (both HMI or Tungsten) yes can look a little weird without diffusion....they are really designed to be used through some sort of diffusion. That said it depends on the lens you use in the fixure and the look your are going for. Narrow lenses can look pretty good ....Often times Par 64 Can lights are used like this to mimic direct beans of sunlight. It is the various medium, medium wide, and flood lenses that have paterns to them Also the Arri M series is designed to have a nicer quality of light. although I'd still put it through some diffusion. your dead on with the idea to use a 4x4 of Opal. Opal works great to diffuse a sharp sources just a little bit and looks pretty realistic.

^ appears to be a film light as she is backlit from the sun. the first examples I think that the close ups could be bounce but that wide shot on the bridge is probably an HMI through a big Frame for fill. The first examples seemed less overcast and more just over exposed sky...maybe it was a little hazy that day? seems like you want to avoid blue sky and a lot of color in your frames so avoid color and keep the sun behind the talent for sure. shooting into the sun helps get that sky less saturated. I'd fill with either bounces or HMI if you need more power/control and maybe introduce some neg fill. good luck, post your results and experience if you can!