David T. Nethery

The point was already made about how the films of the Silent Era were not intentionally herky-jerky, with blown out contrast, and a lot of dirt and scratches , but I've never seen the point made better than in Kevin Brownlow's and David Gill's great documentary series "Hollywood", in Episode 1: "The Pioneers". Watch starting from about 02:16 mark - to - 05:42 (Actually , watch the whole thing ! It's good ! Sad that it's unavailable on DVD or BluRay ... apparently there are copyright issues that prevent it from being released . There are earlier Laser Disc and VHS copies floating around . The YouTube link below is from a VHS copy, so it is actually not the best quality either, but watchable.) https://youtu.be/yS37kyfnGy4?t=136 ----- (and of course , everyone on this forum should love Episode 11 "Trick of the Light" , all about the cameramen, cameras, developments in lighting techniques, and trick photography. The information on how they pulled off some of those trick photography shots is incredible. )

I can confirm from my own experience that the light meter in the R10 can get stuck and it is between $250 - $300 to repair , depending on who gives you the estimate. The best price estimate I was quoted for repair on the R10 light meter was from MicroDelta in Spain (about $80.00 U.S. dollars for repairing the stuck light meter) , but if you are in the U.S. the shipping there and back is going to run about $200 .

As above from Andries Molenaar. I'll just add that a copy of the user manual can be found on this page: http://www.apecity.com/

Wow, yes, $250 was very good deal for the Switar lenses alone !

http://www.bolexcollector.com/cameras/h16rex5.html. According to the serial number 229788 it is RX

Ok, never mind . I got confirmation over in the Bolex forum that the adapter lens for the Bolex Octameter/viewfinder is the same for both the H16 Octameter and the H8 Octameter , so I've already ordered one from eBay.

Thank you. I'm familiar with Toeppen (I think his film is perf'd by Wittner) and I was attempting to order 30.5m/100' ft. rolls from Foma's webstore , but they only deliver within the EU . However, I found out that Freestyle Photo in Los Angeles will supply the 100' ft. rolls of double-8mm as a special order item. They currently have the 10m/33'ft. rolls in stock , but I would really prefer to use the 100' ft. rolls for the Bolex H8 , so I can film longer before turning the film over for the second run through the camera.

Oh, ok ! Thank you. That's good to know. (maybe that's why I can't find any "5.5mm Octameter adapters" listed , but I find many "10mm Octameter adapters" listed ? ) Well, then I will just buy one of the 10mm adapters and add it to my H8's Octameter when I'm using the 5.5mm Switar on the H8. I'm feeling like we're in the very last days of double-8mm and I want to get some more use out of this wonderful old H8 camera before 8mm goes away forever. Film stock is pretty much limited to Fomapan, but that's ok with me , I like B&W. I don't understand why Kodak won't supply un-perforated 16mm to people who want to perforate it for 8mm , but apparently it's not something Kodak is much interested in doing ... supposedly they will supply it with something like a minimum order of 4000 ft. , but I'm not even sure if that is true ... )

I've got a "Want to Buy" post over in the Cine Marketplace asking if anyone has a "Paillard Bolex Supplementary 5.5mm Adapter for H8 Octameter' for sale. But I don't how many people visit that part of the forum very much and I have a question about the 5.5mm adapter, therefore I wanted to post it here. I've seen several of the 10mm adapters (for the H16 Octameter) listed for sale on eBay . I messaged one of the sellers to ask if they every had any of the 5.5mm adapters for the H8 Octameter and the response I received was : "It's the same thing, you can use it on either the H16 Octameter or the H8 Octameter" . Does anyone know if that is true ? Because if the adapter is the same for either the H16 Octameter or the H8 Octameter, then I'll just buy one of the adapters currently listed on eBay. he Octameter I have now on my H8 has a field of view from 6.5mm - to - 75mm , but I have a Kern Switar 5.5mm wide angle lens , so looking through the 6.5mm Octameter I'm not seeing the same field of view as the lens. I supposed the difference of 6.5mm to 5.5mm is perhaps not that much , but I'd still like to have the 5.5mm adapter if possible.

I'm looking for the 'Paillard Bolex Supplementary 5.5mm Field Adapter Lens For H8 Octameter'. The Octameter I have now on my H8 has a field of view from 6.5mm - to - 75mm , but I have a Kern Switar 5.5mm wide angle lens , so looking through the 6.5mm Octameter I'm not seeing the same field of view as the lens. The difference of 6.5mm to 5.5mm is perhaps not that much , but I'd still like to have the 5.5mm adapter if possible. I have come across several of the 10mm adapters (for the H16 Octameter) for sale on eBay , but I'm having difficulty locating the 5.5mm adapter for the H8 Octameter. If anyone has one they would sell , let me know. (the photos show the 10mm adapter for the H-16. One of the eBay sellers who I messaged about it , to see if they have also had a 5.5mm adapter for the H8 , responded : "it's the same thing, you can use it on either the H16 Octameter or the H8 Octameter" . Does anyone know if that is true ?

It is probably the interior nut for the Turret Lock . I had the same thing happen when I unscrewed the large screw on the turret lock (because it had become stuck ) . I heard it fall off and was rattling around inside the film chamber when I moved the camera. https://drive.google.com/open?id=1oAOrtaiK2vyfYhdVJrn3MCE4LKbb0ueR

For anyone coming across this topic in the future , here's a page from the 'Bolex Reporter' magazine, Vol. 14 , No. 2 from 1964 , giving the official company line on lenses suitable for Bolex cameras.

The Hand Crank for the Cine-Kodak K-100 camera: I've owned my K-100 camera almost 20 years and have kept a look out for the hand-crank on eBay, etc. , but haven't ever come across the hand-crank , nor the motor drive shaft (which I am not as interested in , but would certainly grab one if it came up for a reasonable price). Does anyone have a lead on where to obtain such an item ? If you own one of the hand cranks would you post a series of high-res. photos showing it from different angles , photographed next to a ruler for scale ? I wonder if I could get someone to fabricate one for me.

It is indeed a mysterious brew of imprecise values . I had never come across the "170-degree" shutter value you mention, except with reference to the later Bolex EL and EBM . Previously my reading from various internet sources (including this forum and BolexCollector.com ) was that we had earlier non-reflex H16 and H8 with the 190 (192) degree shutter, then after serial number 100401 the 144-degree shutter , then finally with REX-2 - through- REX-5 the 130-degree shutter . I contacted Jesse Chambless (recommended by Bolex Intl.) about my Bolex H8 and he said based on the serial number and the double-claw , it would be a 144-degree shutter.

I actually have a physical copy of the same set of instructions that came with the H-8 camera (serial number 112886, c. 1955) . Of course, I purchased this camera used , so there is no way of knowing for sure if the previous owner(s) had acquired those instructions with the H-8 camera originally or had picked up that instruction booklet somewhere along the way and added it to the kit. But if those instructions were part of the original camera kit from Paillard , then that note about exposure times : "16 frames per second , exposure time is 1/40 sec. ; at 24 frames per second it is 1/60 sec." means that this H-8 camera has a 144-degree shutter. But then there is this: Ok, now there is one more piece to add to the puzzle ... I had thought the shutter angle options were: 190-degrees (earlier non-reflex H16 and H8, before serial number 100401) , 144-degrees (later non-reflex H16 and H8, earlier H16 Reflex) , and 133-degrees (reflex H16 and H8 ) . 170-degrees is a new number to deal with.

Ok, yes, the older H16 I have (with serial number 98890) does have the single claw (with the slightly triangular cover) , so it has the 190-degree shutter. I had previously assumed my H8 (serial 112886) was also a 190-degree shutter , but as I reexamine the H8 more closely I see that the H8 has the double claw. So, I'm confused about your mention that the H16 M is the only Bolex with a 144 degree shutter , because the Bolex H16/H8 user manual I have (found here: Bolex H16_Bolex H8 _user_manual) gives this information about exposure times when using a light meter: "When using an exposure meter, remember that at 16 frames per second , exposure time is 1/40 sec. ; at 24 frames per second it is 1/60 sec." (see screen shot from manual here) Which would be exposure times consistent with a 144 degree shutter angle . My Bolex H8 has a serial number 112886 (which would be a manufacture date of 1955 , according to this list of Bolex serial numbers: http://bolexcollector.com/articles/07_05_11.html ); my H8 has the two claws , it is non-reflex (so it is not one of the later 130 degree shutter H8 RX cameras) , but according to what this manual says about exposure times it would have the 144 degree shutter , not 190 ... However, to add further confusion for those of us in these latter days who cannot casually "consult your Paillard dealer" as the user manuals advise , another combined H16/H8 manual I found here: https://16mmadventures.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/bolex-camera-h8-h16-user-manual.pdf says this of the exposure time: "The normal time of exposure is 1/30 second at 16 frames per second, which is the normal speed for shooting. When the film is run at 64 frames per second, the exposure is reduced to a quarter of the normal i.e. to 1/120 second." So according to those times (1/30 at 16fps , or 1/120 at 64fps) the camera would have a 190 degree shutter . :wacko: It's a bit maddening that none of the Paillard documentation I can find posted on the internet (or the few original manuals I possess) have a DATE printed on the document. .

Thanks, Dom. Between what you've posted here on the forum, and your blog here: https://cinetinker.blogspot.com/2014/12/rx-vs-non-rx-lenses.html (and the earlier work by Dennis Couzin you referenced from here: https://sites.google.com/site/cinetechinfo/ ) I think I'm finally starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel (or the light at the end of the exit pupil depth, as it were) . Even though Dennis published his findings in 1976 , and he published further information about what he calls the "RX/C Rule" in 1987, it seems to me that this information about how certain C-mount lenses may be used on Bolex Reflex cameras (and vice versa) is still not widely known or understood. It also surprises me that over the years that no one has compiled a list of normal C-Mount lenses that are known to work well on a Bolex RX camera, according to Couzin's "RX/C Rule" : "A C-mount lens works well on a RX camera or RX-mount lens works well on a C-mount camera , if and only if: (1.) The lens is slower than about f/2 or f/2.8 , or stopped down this far ; AND (2.) The lens has a deep set exit pupil, about 1.5” inches or farther into its screw mount." Although I must admit that accurately estimating the depth of the exit pupil is still a little bit mysterious to me, even though Dennis Couzin says “The exit pupil mentioned in clause (2) is not mysterious . It is the appearance of the aperture from which the image forming rays all come . The exit pupil test can be easily applied by eye. View the lens from the rear. Close the iris a few stops . Estimate how deep into the lens the iris appears to be. A finger held along side the lens may help this estimation.” .

Simon, I appreciate all your input (and Dom's) . It's helpful in sorting through all the various information I find on the internet that may or may not be correct . In one of your earlier posts you had mentioned : "Ciné Ektar are of various quality. The one-inch Ektar II is a very fine lens. Much sought also and very expensive still today is the two-inch f/1.6 ." Is the one-inch Ektar II lens you are referring to this one (attached photo) . It's marked Cine Ektar 25mm f:1.9 . I've used this one before with my Cine Kodak K100 , but not on the Bolex RX4 . Would it work ok as long as I am at f/4 or higher ? https://tinyurl.com/CineEktar-25mm

More about using Non-RX designated C-Mount lenses on a Bolex RX camera: In this article: http://bolexh16user.net/H16Lenses.htm , it states that if the non-RX lens focal length is below 50mm , then to be safe it needs to be stopped down to f/3.3 or more to avoid focus problems : "the rule of thumb is if you are shooting with a Non RX lens of 50mm focal length or less on a Bolex Reflex camera of which you've not had chance to do some proper testing with before being used on a shoot stop down the lens to at least f 3.3 or next highest." But also says: "There will be lots of lenses below 50mm in focal length out there that despite not being made by Bolex nor badged as H16 RX and that were never designed with any foreknowledge of being used in a Bolex Reflex camera with a prism in the light path will nevertheless produce no spherical aberrations with use. Only testing a lens fully open will find out." What I'm wondering is if anyone has ever put together a list of non-RX lenses below 50mm in focal length that have been tested with a Bolex RX camera and showed no spherical aberrations ? This would be useful information to have , to know which regular (non-RX) C-Mount lenses are likely to produce good results when used with a Bolex RX camera. Lens tests would still be advisable I'm sure , but it would help to narrow down the available options to non-RX lenses that are known to work well with a RX camera.

I really appreciate you posting this material. Thanks.

Or I'm an idiot and it's just as simple as a straight conversion from inches to millimeters ? Therefore a 1-inch lens is 25mm , a 2-inch lens is 50mm , etc

I sometimes read this sort of lens designation , i.e "a one-inch lens" or a "two-inch" lens , in older film literature, but I have to admit I don't understand exactly what the scale of "one-inch" , "two-inch" , etc. refers to ... For example , I have Cine Ektar lenses on my Kodak K100 that are designated with focal length in mm: 15mm , 25mm, and 63mm ... so what is the equivalent focal length of a "one-inch lens" in relation to the focal length given in mm ? Is there a chart you can refer me to that shows the equivalent mm focal length of one-inch , two-inch, three-inch , etc. lenses ? (I'm not sure how high up the scale it goes ... are there four-inch, five-inch, six-inch , or higher Cine lenses ? )

Thanks for the additional info, Dom . That is helpful. So , yes, I wonder if the camera I have , with serial no. 98890 , is in the transitional period from the 190-degree shutter to the 144- degree shutter ... I looked at the video you linked to ... mine looks almost, but not quite the same as the camera interior shown in the video. I'm also going to email Bolex Intl. SA to see if they can tell me for sure. I'd be happy to know it's got a 190-degree shutter, because then I can use one of my standard light meters (Gossen Scout 2 or Sekonic L-158) with the Cine Scale , because those are based on a 180-degree shutter and the difference between a read-out based on 180 (1/48 sec.) or 190-degrees (1/45 sec.) is going to be minimal .

Well, I found this user manual online ... https://tinyurl.com/Bolex-H16-manual -- based on the exposure time given and the camera models that are referred to in the manual (H-16 Standard , H-8 , H-16 Reflex) I would place the manual's publication at around 1954 - 1958 ... and the exposure time given in the manual for 24fps is 1/60 sec. , which would be a 144 degree shutter. If the Bolex Collector website has the correct info on serial numbers then my camera with serial number 98890 , manufactured in 1954, has the 144 degree shutter.

I recently picked up a non-reflex Bolex H-16 , serial number 98890 , so according to what you wrote above it should have the 190 (192) degree shutter , but according to the serial numbers given here : http://www.bolexcollector.com/cameras/h16supreme.html this camera with serial number 98890 was manufactured in 1954 and has a 144 degree shutter. I haven't shot any film with it yet , but I am looking forward to testing it . However, now I'm confused if I should be metering based on a 144 degree shutter or 190 degree shutter. Is there some way to tell for sure if the shutter is 144 or 190 ?