the social awkwardness of devoting your life to film...

[Annie Wengenroth]

I know this has been mentioned before but I thought it might be worth resurrecting after a recent [unpleasant] interaction with an old friend of mine. Everyone on this board is obviously very passionate about filmmaking, specificallly cinematography. We are all aware of the sacrifices we make in order to keep doing what we do. I just started working at a rental house and I love it because I am surrounded by all these beautiful cameras and lenses which continue to fascinate me. I have about 3 hours a day in which I have legitimate "free time". Whether on set or at work, I'm pretty much always busting my ass these days, because for the first time in my life, I have very specific goals about where I want to be in 10 years and how to get there.

 

Well, apparently this makes me boring and predictable, because I guess All I Talk About Is Cameras, and I guess most people out there cannot relate to you once you really sink your teeth into something and run with it until it becomes your life. I knew when I started getting really into film that I would often be sacrificing sleep, routine, and social contact, and I am still willing to accept that. But sometimes I feel this huge and profound sense of isolation at being so driven towards something that most of the world can't relate to. Granted I have always battled this ever since finding out the other kids in first grade don't like to spend hours sitting alone and drawing or reading a book. And granted I could easily attack "normal" people with "normal" jobs for selling their souls to a 9-to-5 desk jockey shift that they don't care about, so that they can drive their nice car and live in their nice house. So that they can sum up what they do in three sentences or less without having to draw diagrams about it.

 

But I don't attack these people because ultimately, I just want to be able to tell them what I do without being dismissed as being narrow-minded or one-dimensional. Can you imagine somebody saying that to Van Gogh? "All you talk about is painting; it's really boring." (No wonder he cut off his ear...!?) We are all artists, engineers, and technicians here and damn right this is all we do! Is there a problem with that?? Is working for a giant company, wearing a suit, and throwing away your Bachelor of Fine Arts degree to sit a desk any better? Because I've sure run into people like that; if they're not telling me that All You Do Is Talk About Cameras, they're telling me that they wish they could do it! I would basically argue that all good artists are at least a little obsessive about their craft, and that's just how it goes.

 

Having said that, is this sort of social situation going to get any better by the time I hit 30 or is it just going to get worse? Should I narrow my social circles to people within the industry and hide what I do from everyone else? I could pretend I'm a secretary or something; it might be funny. Should I even bother leaving the apartment once I get home from work? I can deal with it either way, I'm just wondering what everybody else's experiences have been here and if anyone else has ever been accused of being boring; or worse, "a grunt who holds the camera"! I love what I do but I fear that I will become socially stunted. Unless I am already and you guys are just being really, really nice to me... :P

[Tomas Koolhaas]

I know this has been mentioned before but I thought it might be worth resurrecting after a recent [unpleasant] interaction with an old friend of mine. Everyone on this board is obviously very passionate about filmmaking, specificallly cinematography. We are all aware of the sacrifices we make in order to keep doing what we do. I just started working at a rental house and I love it because I am surrounded by all these beautiful cameras and lenses which continue to fascinate me. I have about 3 hours a day in which I have legitimate "free time". Whether on set or at work, I'm pretty much always busting my ass these days, because for the first time in my life, I have very specific goals about where I want to be in 10 years and how to get there.

 

Well, apparently this makes me boring and predictable, because I guess All I Talk About Is Cameras, and I guess most people out there cannot relate to you once you really sink your teeth into something and run with it until it becomes your life. I knew when I started getting really into film that I would often be sacrificing sleep, routine, and social contact, and I am still willing to accept that. But sometimes I feel this huge and profound sense of isolation at being so driven towards something that most of the world can't relate to. Granted I have always battled this ever since finding out the other kids in first grade don't like to spend hours sitting alone and drawing or reading a book. And granted I could easily attack "normal" people with "normal" jobs for selling their souls to a 9-to-5 desk jockey shift that they don't care about, so that they can drive their nice car and live in their nice house. So that they can sum up what they do in three sentences or less without having to draw diagrams about it.

 

But I don't attack these people because ultimately, I just want to be able to tell them what I do without being dismissed as being narrow-minded or one-dimensional. Can you imagine somebody saying that to Van Gogh? "All you talk about is painting; it's really boring." (No wonder he cut off his ear...!?) We are all artists, engineers, and technicians here and damn right this is all we do! Is there a problem with that?? Is working for a giant company, wearing a suit, and throwing away your Bachelor of Fine Arts degree to sit a desk any better? Because I've sure run into people like that; if they're not telling me that All You Do Is Talk About Cameras, they're telling me that they wish they could do it! I would basically argue that all good artists are at least a little obsessive about their craft, and that's just how it goes.

 

Having said that, is this sort of social situation going to get any better by the time I hit 30 or is it just going to get worse? Should I narrow my social circles to people within the industry and hide what I do from everyone else? I could pretend I'm a secretary or something; it might be funny. Should I even bother leaving the apartment once I get home from work? I can deal with it either way, I'm just wondering what everybody else's experiences have been here and if anyone else has ever been accused of being boring; or worse, "a grunt who holds the camera"! I love what I do but I fear that I will become socially stunted. Unless I am already and you guys are just being really, really nice to me... :P

 

Hi annie,

I'm not sure how old you are (nor would I be so impolite to ever ask a lady her age)... but it may be an age thing; many people in their twenties haven't decided exactly what the want as a Career (which is very different to a meare job) so if your friends are that age, they may just not understand the drive and passion you have. They may see what you consider focus and determination to a single goal as being one dimensional and boring. I am 25 and have experienced a similar thing, my friends back in England mostly do whatever Job they can for the time being that will pay the rent/bills and make enough money to go out and get hammered on the weekends, they dont really have a career or ultimate goal in mind. I remember telling them I was shooting over a weekend once, they acted as if I had comited a travisty against nature "working on the bloody weekend!!?????". However my friends in LA all know what they want to do and are setting about attaining it the best way they can, whether it is acting, VisualFX, production design or still photography they all have a passion, and I think this is what seperates people in life, those that go with the flow and those which steer the ship in the direction they want. Most of the people that went with the flow seem to end up realising what they really wanted to do only when they retire from their horrendous desk job at 70, and sadly for them some people never discover a passion. For me when I discovered my career it really marked my transition from a boy to a man, you go from having nothing on your mind but how to get your next kick to how you are going to achieve your next goal in life, perhaps your friends haven't made this transition yet and therefor cannot relate to your single minded ambition.

By the way (and I'm not suggesting this is true in your case Annie!) there are some people that never talk about ANYTHING but film, and dont hang around with ANYONE who isn't into film, and seem to have NO interests outside film, I think that is very different from having a good passionate goal and being meticulous about it, and is not healthy in my opinion. I have many interests outside of film and many friends who are completely uninvolved with film, and often find them a welcome break for the constant "industry" conversation and sub-culture in LA.

Cheers.

[Dan Goulder]

Hey Spikey,

Sorry you're going through a rough patch. (I think Van Gogh was miserable and never made any money, so you may not want to use that example. I guess he proved it's possible to be miserable, broke, and produce great art.) Your sensitivity right now may seem like a burden, but it's also an asset. You wouldn't want it to not be there, and probably couldn't get rid of it anyway. It sounds like you're doing what you love. Why do otherwise? Not everyone's going to understand, but it will also be liberating for you to realize they don't have to. Plenty of people will. Take care.

[David Mullen ASC]

No, I'm positive that ordinary folks are always fascinated when I launch into a long description of the widescreen camera formats of the 1950's, or how 3-strip Technicolor worked.

 

I had to come to terms that I was a nerd before high school even...

 

You just have to find the right person, probably someone with a similar obsession over something, equally socially unacceptable, a fellow nerd, whatever.

[Robert Edge]

Annie,

 

I have several friends who do the same thing that I do for a living, but I find that I much prefer to spend time with them when we are talking about something other than our mutual occupation.

 

Most of my really close friends do something else for a living than what I do. There is no pattern here. Some of them even work at 9-5 jobs, and I haven't noticed that they are less interesting or intelligent than friends who work irregular hours.

[Jonathan Spear]

""And granted I could easily attack "normal" people with "normal" jobs for selling their souls to a 9-to-5 desk jockey shift that they don't care about, so that they can drive their nice car and live in their nice house.""

 

And you should!

 

Bastards! :lol:

 

You only live once, right? So why waste the relatively short amount of time they have on Earth being some corporate drone?

 

When I find myself thinking "All you ever talk about is --- " when a friend goes off about something, it's usually because I'm jealous he/she seems so passionate and full of life.

 

And you seem like a cool person, so making friends (and contacts) along the way will be a piece of cake.

 

Enjoy the ride!

[Phil Rhodes]

You have Aspergers', I have Aspergers', we all have Aspergers' together...

[Brian Drysdale]

Fortunately, this industry requires you to have a lot different skills. There are hobbies and/or interests that that will assist you both in your career (with new skills) and your social life. Also, it impresses employers if you've done something that might be of use on their production.

 

I know one NY DP who was into mountaineering - sailing and diving are also useful. I've done acting classes (don't give up the day job), which is useful when dealing with actors and also good for meeting people. Dance or Tai Chi can help with developing your sense of movement which is useful when you're hand holding or operating Steadicam. Classes are always difficult to fit in when you're freelance, but learning about art history, drawing, music etc. might be useful later.

[Andy Sparaco SOC]

To survive in this business you must hold tightly to your goals.

 

As you work more, achieve your objectives and grow more confident that you will "make it". You will feel more comfortable spending time doing other things. We are at a curious time when "film making" has become a social activity rather then an art/craft/profession.

 

Your focus may seem a bit much to "ordinary folks", who usually are without much passion for what seems intangible.

[Annie Wengenroth]

Well, considering my vast array of hobbies outside of this industry, I sort of wonder what my so-called "friend" was complaining about. Damn kids in their 20's. :P To put it another way, it's one thing to have some hobby that I really enjoy that nobody else does, but it's another thing to have legitimate career goals which apparently confuse my grandparents, bore my friends from high school, and tend to baffle strangers at bars. ("I'm a Camera Assistant!"...."A What?") It's frustrating to feel like other people can go on and on about THEIR jobs all day and That's Fascinating!...Really? and then in my case, I have to patiently explain that Well No, I Don't Just Stand There Holding The Camera.

 

Phil, I googled Asperger's and I don't have it, can I be an honorary member of the club anyway?

 

To clarify some finer points here, I'm not trying to imply here that I don't have any friends and I might as well start dying my hair black again and wearing vinyl pants all the time, or that I don't do anything else besides this, because that's not true either. I am long aware of the fact that when you're creative, it's going to be harder to find a comfortable niche in this world no matter what you do. I'm simply a little taken aback- and a little amused, to be sure- that when somebody tells me they work at a desk for 8 hours a day, I'm supposed to be impressed, and then when I tell them about what I do, they either call me a grunt, complain about my wacky schedule, or zone out on me.

[Brian Drysdale]

I shouldn't worry about it, people have different expectations, just go for what you what to achieve. You'll find that some people just won't understand, while others are slightly jealous, but that's their problem. Friends will accept you for who you are, rather than the job you're doing.

[Andy Sparaco SOC]

Asperger's is a form of autism. Characterized by a high IQ but an inability to cope with a social situation or change of routine. An extreme form of shyness. Shoot two hundred feet of 7201 and you will be fine

[Josh Bass]

So, wait, I'm confused now.

 

Do you or do you not eat/sleep/breathe cameras/lenses day and night?

 

I myself am somewhat torn. I like to work, I like it when I have a good idea for a movie and it call comes toegether and gets brought to life, or I like it (sometimes) when I"m PAing, and I like it when I get to shoot and light and all that, but at the same time, Bassy likes his leisure time, oh yes he does.

 

I've gotten back into playing guitar recently (I dressed up as Slash in a recent short I did. Don't ask--somehow it got me listening to G'n'R again which got me playing their songs again), so now I focus a lot on that.

 

So um, I don't know what the point is. I like to maintain a balance between work and. . .not work.

[David Mullen ASC]

A lot of people don't know what a cinematographer does -- even my mother is not completely sure. It's something you get used to. Truth is, most of us as kids want generic careers (doctor, lawyer, fireman, astronaut, cowboy, senator, etc.) that everyone knows about, but many of us end being some sort of specialist with a title that many people didn't even know was a job.

[Annie Wengenroth]

I think cinematographers are cooler than firemen, but don't tell the NYFD I said that...

 

When I really think about it, I'm kinda on the same page as Josh. As important as this is to me, I feel that if my life were to become unbalanced, I wouldn't be able to do any of this stuff as well as I do. When your priorities shift and something becomes the only thing in your life, I think you tend to perform a little differently. I had this friend in elementary and middle school who played all the same sports as me except that her mother was obsessed with being the best Soccer/Basketball/Baseball/Track Mom in the entire county. Her daughter was a natural and she knew it!

 

And sure enough, my friend was really, really good at sports, especially at basketball. She got onto the all-star team by sixth grade and pretty soon she was travelling to games and it was becoming her life. Long story short, she got to college on a basketball scholarship but just wasn't as into it anymore and yes, there were people out there who were better than her... and now she's considering med school, not the WNBA. She could still kick my ass in a game of one-on-one but I could still hit every shot outside the key in a game of Horse. I think in the end, it almost doesn't matter how much you narrow your focus (no pun intended) to that One Thing That Matters because you've either got it or you don't, and you're not gonna lose it by skateboarding and going to shows on the weekend.

 

So yes, in many ways I eat/sleep/breathe/talk in my sleep about film, but lately I've been thinking more about finding a comfortable balance within the context of "This is the most important thing to me right now". Dedication doesn't always come down to spending all your time on something; my family is important to me and I don't live with them and spend every minute with them. Initially, I was shocked by the accusation of being boring and one-sided because when you look beneath the surface, I am far from it. In fact, my parents remain pleasantlly shocked that I have managed to find a specific and concise career goal that is completely realistic...I mean, the rock star thing just wouldn't have worked out anyway.

[Phil Rhodes]

Hi,

 

Two observations:

 

- If you are not viewed as slightly unhinged by all around you, you aren't sufficiently into it.

 

- Realistic?

 

Phil

[Jason Debus]

I've found that it's not too hard to find something 'common' to talk about, because everyone watches movies. I find myself saying a lot, 'have you seen this movie ... ' and there's plenty of people willing to talk about what they did and didn't like about a particular movie.

 

Most people don't care about the technical stuff, but I've found some family members responding to something we've talked about. For example, my mother was talking about the end of 'Fail Safe' when the nuke goes off on New York and how the freeze frames were so effective. I responded with, 'great editing technique!' She then realized what she was seeing was made in the editing room, and had a similar 'wow' type response.

 

If someone likes movies and art, it shouldn't be too hard to find common ground with them.

[Mark Allen]

It seems like the underlying importance to this issue is that you're at a point in your life where you are realizing you are defining what your life will be. That the paths you choose now will define what your life experience will be. And you're right. Lucky though that you are discovering this now though because most people in the world stumble into their lives without much of a plan. I'm guessing you're young twenties and just out of college and it seems like this is usually the age at which people set a direction which seems to last for at least a decade. (The sensation of time increases exponentially, so a decade can zoom by.)

 

Seems to me that people who end up with success at some point are the people who have been very focused on one thing. Usually because the time eventually timing comes around where you'll be in the right mindset, right place, right time. People who jump from one thing to the next seem to always be a tad too late (or too early).

 

Just make sure in all your focusedness, you do take some time out to enjoy the fact that your body doesn't hurt in the morning. :)

 

Also - listen to people's stories. You might find yourself fascinated and inspired by what some people have to say. Just because someone isn't in the arts, they still might have a fascinating stories. You don't have to talk about film, you don't have to talk at all. People are more than willing to share themselves - and it's very much like a movie. You can control it to some degree, fish for certain paths of information.

 

I forget the source, but I remember in high school I came across the dating advice... "If you find yourself really nervous about going on a date - it's because you're putting to much of the focus on yourself. Put the focus on them instead. They'll appreciate the attention, you'll be off the hook and less nervous, and you might find out something you didn't know." Works for business meetings as well.

[Josh Bass]

Oooh. . .I'm more than a little unhinged. In fact, my door is being held in place by a rusty paper clip.

 

 

Sometimes I feel inadequate 'cause I think back to "rebel without a crew" and how Rodriguez made a movie (albeit a shitty one) every day since like the age of 12. I feel pathetic next to that. That guy's dedicated. I know a lotta you guys don't care for him, and that's fine, but you can't deny the passion.

 

Me, I have a very hard time concentrating on my own projects unless they're already written in my head and just ready to get onto paper/the computer. When I get stuck on writing, it just shuts me down. Part of that's 'cause I don't believe in forcing something out just to do it--I'd rather wait 'til something "right" clicks. I'm an AWESOME procrastinator, too. I have several things I could be working on RIGHT NOW. but I'm not.

[James Steven Beverly]

Rodriguez it Rodriguez and you are you. You have to find your own way. But your right, discipline is not something that comes naturally to everyone, it's something that for most people, creative one especially, has to be developed. Try baby steps first, work 15 minutes a day no matter what and longer when you feel like it, at the same time of day or as close to the same time as possible. Let everyone know, this is YOU TIME TO WORK. No interruptions no distractions. After 2 weeks, go to a half hour, and so on, and so on, until your working 2 to 3 hours a day. If your problem is you have trouble coming up with original story lines and ideas, well then, welcome to Hollywood! A lot of films are adapted from books and other source materials. Go to the library and find something you want to make into a film. I know Steven King has been very generious to young filmmakers with some of his shorter works, sometimes allowing them to option the property for as little as a dollar. Write the authors, ask them if you can use their material, I meant what have you got to loose. Or find something in public domain. Look at all the Jane Austin stuff that's been done. Work on more that one idea at a time, if you get mired in one script, try looking a different one with fresh eyes for a while. Lay out the story structure instead of writing dialogueonce in a while. Sometimes a storyline and stucture will lend it'self to telling you what the charatures have to say in order for that scene to work. Ask yourself "What's the purpose of this scene. How does it move the story along. Is the dialogue truthful, the charactures speaking to one and other in a way that seem natural and what does each one want and how does this dialogue achieve that goal" and finally "Is this cinematic" because a movie with out sound are still a movie but a movie without picture is called radio. Try skipping a scene your stuck on and write one you've imagined for later or earlier in the story (the old index card method), sometimes it's easier to work backwards to find where you charactures and dialogue have to go in order for a sequence or the entire script to work. Go back and read a few scenes prior to where you've run into the block and let your mind wander, sometimes the next line will just pop into your head and sometimes the reason you get blocked is you took a wrong turn somewhere and you have to rewite an earlier scene to stay on track and make the later one work or maybe your just too close to the material and have to roll into it the get started again. I have a screenplay based on Robin Hood that I haven't finished the third act for because although I know in general what happens I hadn't come up with enough compelling details to warrent continuing at this point. so I set it aside, as I did when I had the same trouble with the 2nd act. I'll read it again at somepoint down the road, fall in love with it again and finish it when I'm ready. Above all scripts are made in the rewrites. If something is crap remember, It's a computer not a stone tablet, get it "on paper" and move on. Noone uses a first draft as the shooting script that I've ever heard of, and if they did, there are changes made to it during prodution, you can be sure. Be tenatious, like Cmdr. Peter Quincy Taggart said in Galaxy Quest "Never give up! Never surrender" and as Speilberg once said"Thank God for the 5th draft"

[Josh Bass]

Thanks, uh, Captain.

 

The discipline idea is not bad.

 

My problem is not the lack of ideas, it's getting stuck while trying to execute them.

 

One thing I should mention is that at this point, maybe for always, I have no interest in using anyone else's ideas. . .that special thrill comes from having something that was shat from my own mind come into existence, and hopefully entertain people. So it has to originate with the Bass as well as be executed by the Bass.

 

I don't really want to go into this more in this thread, since it's all about Annie. And her awkwardness. Her awkwardness when someone says. . ."do you want to eat first or see the movie first?" and she says "a 75mm zeiss prime lense"

[Guest LondonFilmMan]

Annie, its sounds like the amount of hours you are working. You know the proverb about all work and no play....don't you..?

[Annie Wengenroth]

Yeah. Gate's clean.

 

...Sorry, what?

 

:P

 

Is it bad to wear my tool belt on the first date? What if I tell a stupid film school story? What if I eat the salad with an orangewood stick instead of a spoon?

[Josh Bass]

"Annie, its sounds like the amount of hours you are working. You know the proverb about all work and no play....don't you..?"

 

What he's saying is you'll soon end up typing the same thing over and over again, and then try to kill your wife and son with an axe. At least I think that's what he's saying.

[Annie Wengenroth]

Sure, but the Steadicam work will be fantastic.