First Experance With 16mm?

[Dory Breaux DP]

I love it when good bargains like come along. Actually, once at a stall at a flea market, I came across a pile of out of date B&W 16mm 100ft films selling for $3 each. I was a bit hesitant because they were probably extremely old, judging by the old / vintage style of lettering on the boxes! So I bought three of the films. However, later that evening at home, I regretted my decision to just buy three. I may not come across another opportunity to buy 16mm film so cheaply again - and there could be a decent chance that the film could turn out okay. So the following Sunday, I returned to the flea market but the seller was not there. Several weeks later, the seller was back at the market and this time he was selling the 16mm films for $2 each. I bought the whole lot without hesitation and placed them in my fridge.

 

At that point, I had no 16mm camera, though I was shooting on super 8 at the time. The purchase of the film stock allowed me to buy a 16mm camera, a K3, from a camera fair. Since then Ive exposed two of these old B&W films (both Tri-X) and they've turned out fine. I was speaking with a guy from a lab on the phone and judging by the metal cans that the films came in, he estimates that they are at least 15 years out of date!

 

Luckieness!

[Michael Nash]

My first experience with 16mm wasn't actually my first experience with film. My first movie camera was a GAF super-8, with auto-exposure only. I learned filmmaking on that camera, although not the finer points of photography...

 

In High School I experimented with video a little, although "consumer" video was incredibly primitive then. Let's just say this was before many of you were even born... ;)

 

It wasn't until college that I shot Plus-X and Tri-X reversal on a Spring-wound Bell & Howell. I couldn't quite figure out how to use the school's analogue light meter, and instead went off the "sunny 16 rule" and eyeballed exposures from there. It actually worked pretty well! I had noticed that other students' work was consistently dark and underexposed, so I was determined to open that iris. Some stuff naturally came back overexposed...

 

Entering the work force I went straight into broadcast video (local TV and corporate) and didn't really shoot any film again until I'd established myself as a DP, at least to a couple clients :P. My first professional commercial on 16mm with an Eclair NPR had the wrong lenses with it (a different mount; likely Arri std instead of B ), and so the lenses didn't seat properly. I didn't know any better at the time that the soft image in the VF was what is was going to look like in telecine... Can you say, "reshoot?" Fortunately the producer was understanding since he too was pushing to get out of video and into film.

 

That was a big a wakeup call to me and probably when I got serious about the technical aspects of film. That experience paid off tremendously, forcing me to understand all the details of the tools I'm using. Needless to say things have gotten much better since then :D .

[Michael Collier]

Interesting david should mention learning about keeping the veiwfinder covered. I learned that point before shooting my first and became so hyper sensative to make sure my eye was on the vf, or to make sure the shutter was closed that for like 3days after I shot, I kept trying to close the shutter on the vf of my betacam at work! I got a little too used to film way, way too quickly. it was a shock to the senses to see a zebra-patterned b/w standard def imageb while shooting again.

 

It was cool though to see the effect on the shot since most takes I would have my eye off the viewfinder when it rolled up and only covered it just prior to the slate. Day exteriors were the most interesting, esp on the shots I had already overexposed in rating.

 

now I have my k3 on its way, and hopefully if I win the ebay 4 rolls of 7218, 3 rolls mixed double-x kodachrome and color neg. Also I have 300ft of 7218 16mm and 250ft of 8mm cut from 5205 (250D) in the fridge (my first dedicated film fridge). More film on the way too. I have commited myself to shooting at least 100ft every week or so to really bring me up to speed quickly (not much but I can really experiment). I feel left out since people like david and hal shot 8mm as kids like it was nothing, and the closest I got to 8mm was in hi-8 (not quite the same).

 

I think from my first experience shooting 4063 feet has me hooked. To think there was a time less than 3 years ago when I thought I never would shoot film or want to. Now I look at my betacam with disdain.

[Philip Nasadowski]

I was the proverbial A/V geek in school too. I don't remember many films, just watching the film go through the Singer projector we always got. Middle school, we had B&H autojams.

 

I always had a thing for shooting film, and my aunt gave me one of thm old Kodak super 8mms. As some of you know, those cameras basically self destruct.

 

Anyway, 2 years ago I was buying an antique TV up in CT and the guy had a box of 16mm stuff - an old Keystone. Ended up with that, too. Shot a few rolls, got a Bolex. The Bolex was an antique, had lousy registration, and I ended up getting a (newer) reflex one, that I now use.

 

Most of my shooting's been home movie and such, but it's fun and supposedly keeps me out of trouble :)

[Antonio Bunt]

Here are my 2 cents:

Since I was a little child, my uncle used to film my cousins and I on Super 8 and then project the resulting rolls on family gatherings. Besides, my dad had a Brazilian 16 mm projector and I still can remember my 7th. birthday and I guess it was my only real party and my father showed his motivational films to all my guests. I guess the messages was not really understood since I am not a better person but I loved and felt overwhelmed by the moving images. Film is in my blood!

I shot my first 7277 way back ten years ago. It was one of the first VISION films that came to the market to replace the EXR family. I borrowed an Arri S that had trouble threading the film on a 400 ft. magazine so it cut the film several times. After the film was processed, my reaction was that of Colonel Kurtz: THE HORROR!

It turns out that the film was completely overexposed. Later I found out the DoP never had any experience with film and I was an ignorant myself. The emulsion was facing the lens!!! Besides I didn't know what emulsion was back then!!! Another DoP told me that particular emulsion was very delicate and he was suprprised Kodak never told me about it. I never found out if he was telling the truth or said that just to calm me down. Anyway I started to hate those Kodak guys and I raised money to shoot again.

Then I shot on Fuji 500T film with a borrowed Bolex and it came out perfectly.

Then I became a video guy for a while. Sorry film brotherhood!!! I was sooooo wrong.

Now I am on my path again and the local Kodak people helped me a lot now that they are different than the other guys. I shoot on Super 8 mainly but I am trying to recover my K3.

I love film and 16 mm is so noble I hope to keep using it for a while!

Edited April 2, 2007 by Antonio Bunt

[Mitch Beaudry]

My first experience with 16mm wasn't all that exciting. Being young enough to be part of the "video generation" I never saw an inch of film until film school. I remember being excited about the prospect of shooting on film but I was surrounded with the "Film is dead" manifesto I thought it would be more of a neat exercise and not something I can use in the real world.

 

Yes, I was naive and plainly stupid.

 

We were using Arri SRIIIs and were just shooting simple exposure tests. Riveting. Although, when I saw the footage I learned very quickly the advantages film had for me over video.

 

The next two (also the last two) terms I fought tooth and nail to shoot my projects on film rather than video (at the Toronto Film School where I went, you have to pitch to get anything shot on film). I was successful and shot one project on 16mm and another on 35mm. The footage was worth the hard work it took to get to shoot it for sure.

[Matt Wells]

My first experience not that thrilling - I was already into super8 and about 3 years ago I bought a mint Beaulieu R16. I bought a selection of Fuji film and experimented with the various stocks.

[Mitch Lusas]

My first experience shooting was just two months after I decided to enter Cinematography. Luckily, I had been doing still photography for six years.

 

The director wanted to shoot on color stock, and go black&white in post. The film was a modern detective story. The main character turns out to be Hitler.

 

So the director wanted film noir to help the omnious atmosphere. I was so green that I had not yet learned that if you take your eye off the eyepiece, it exposes the film. This mistake was quickly fixed by my camera operator.

 

While shooting, I used a lot of gobos and hard light. In order to distort reality, I used a lot of wide angle lenses. The problem was, half-way through the shoot, the only light meter I had (a reflective Minolta) began malfunctioning; shutting off, reseting, and giving false readings. Thus began my, "guess that exposure" game! I feared overexposing, and figured I could always go darker (a la the Gordon Willis approach). Needless to say, some of the film was quite dark. However, some of my guesses turned out to be extremely beautiful (especially one shot where the detective is sitting over his desk pondering over the maps, with smoke from the ashtray rising against a map of Europe).

 

As it was one of my first gigs I didn't think to push the director for a copy of the film. I'll probably track it down someday as there are a few really nice shots in there.

 

After this experience, I bought my Sekonic 558 and have never looked back.

 

Camera: Arri SRIII

Lenses used: 12, 16, 25

Film Stock: Sadly, I didn't know much about film stocks, I just knew it was Kodak

Length: 10 Minute Film

[Mark Dunn]

I was so green that I had not yet learned that if you take your eye off the eyepiece, it exposes the film.

 

What?

[Dan Salzmann]

It was in the mid 80's. I had shot super8 and still pictures for about 15 years and got my hands on a Scopic 16M. It was a real thrill and since this camera is like a giant super8 the only thing that was daunting was the price of film stock. Shot on Kodachrome 40 and it came out great. It was also my first telecine and that was really fantastic. It felt like I was on the set of Star Trek.

[Mitch Lusas]

What?

 

 

When we were rolling a static shot, I quickly took my eye off the eyepiece to check something out. By the way, I cam-op'ed a couple shots while my Camera Operator pulled focus. As I did, she quickly and calmly asked what I was doing. Not my most professional moment and never repeated.

 

At that stage in the game I had only one experience with being around a 16mm film camera; three weeks before, a DP friend brought me on as his 1st AC. As we went he taught me a lot about the SRIII, however, he forgot to teach me about that, probably thinking I already knew. I met the director on the set. When he could not get a DP for the two-day shoot, he decided to give me a chance.

[Nate Downes]

I'd bought 2 16mm cameras already, a magazine load and a Keystone, but never got around to buying film. Then, someone offered me a sweet deal on a K-3 bayonet mount, which I took. Included, a roll of Fuji 125T. I proceeded to buy an 85A filter, and shooting my son with his nana.

 

Just sold that K-3, but the memories remain.

[Dory Breaux DP]

I'd bought 2 16mm cameras already, a magazine load and a Keystone, but never got around to buying film. Then, someone offered me a sweet deal on a K-3 bayonet mount, which I took. Included, a roll of Fuji 125T. I proceeded to buy an 85A filter, and shooting my son with his nana.

 

Just sold that K-3, but the memories remain.

 

Hey I think I've seen that Bayonett K-3 your talkin about... :P

[Guest Michael Carter]

My first experiences with 16mm were when I was teaching art in McKeesport PA in the 90's and we were doing animation with 8mm. I wanted to go full size and bought a Cine Kodak Special II. A stand was made that has back light, top lights, and even a moving background slide bar made from a yard stick. Film pieces were self processed on 110 reels then a Jobo reel that held 6 foot long strips. That is a lot of pictures. Film was High Contrast copy film and it was processed to total black and clear white for pencil tests.

 

Naturally I also shot baby movies but that was using another Special 1 that I bought. I stopped in at a camera store and another customer was trying to sell it to the owner so I bought it! It has the case and a bunch of lenses. It works great.

 

Then came my first Bolex, a Supreme with the deep lenses. It always worked great and I sold it while in England, cause I wanted single perf and reflex and got stung badly on a RX1 at a US camera show. There is a thread about that nightmare here somewhere. However, it was used for a film and died at the last shot but I got the movie and it is on line through my web site. It is the one on Archivedotorg. Nonreflex was better so I bought a retired engineer's Bolex and use it now.

 

Sync sound was desired and so I bought a Auricon Pro 600 variable area Optical Sound On Film camera outfit. It works great, I love to project my own sound on film movies. A lot of help is being given at the new users group: http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/Auricon_Sound/

I have movies on line made with it on youtube. Links are from the above one or from my web site studiocarterdotcom. I'm about to nail sound lamp exposures and use my now working 50 OHMs Auricon E-6 mic.

 

Did I mention that I shot about 200 feet of 50 foot magazines? I had to wind it onto 100 foot spools to get a lab to process it! Films were negative, fully timed prints are awesome!

 

Several hundred feet of film shot in England didn't come out so well because my Keystone A-7 had a out of sync shutter and they are smeared. They look really spooky and appropriate in the castle ruins we explored. But, I learned how to fix those shutters.

 

Michael Carter

Edited April 8, 2007 by Michael Carter

[Alex Haspel]

my first experience with 16mm was dp'ing a rather bad little short movie.

we shot on a 16bl with the 12-120 angenieux stock zoom lens and a 5,9mm angenieux wide angle that had fixed focus at hyperfocal distance (no focus pulling possible).

we shot on expired vision2 expression and had the money for developing and scanning it about half a year after wrap. the neg was very thin by then and the results were pretty grainy with exposure pushed in telecine.

we also shot one murder sequence on super8 with tri-X stock that got developed and scanned at andec in berlin shortly after wrap.

the funny thing is that this and the 16mm stuff fitted perfectly grain wise.

 

here are some stills (off a crappy quicktime file tho):

 

(the last two were the super8 ones)

(honestly)

 

i'm in a writing mood today..

 

my second 16mm experience was dp'ing a 30min short movie lit with nothing but practicals.

shot 7279 because we got it cheap since it was expired also, but only for a few weeks.

camera was the trusty 16bl again but with a set of zeiss highspeed lenses.

the older ones tho, the ones with the 3 bladed iris.

we could only afford a onelight pal telecine, and these are some stills off it:

 

 

bye,

alex