An Inconvenient Truth

[timHealy]

Don't you find it odd that John Kerry didn't fight back from the innuendo's that were being laid at his feet.

A guy who actually was in Viet Nam and who had bullets fly by him from the enemy and he has to back down while George Bush remained unscathed?

 

Suspicious, isn't it?

 

I didn't think it was suspicious. I just thought it was lame. Kerry and the democrats did not go to the mats as much as they could have and I really cannot imagine why. Even during the past two years or so the democrats have had opportunity after opportunity to embarrass the reublicans with issue after issue from Abramoff to Scooter Libby to Karl Rove to Tom Delay to Randy Cunningham to Medicare to a poorly managed war in Iraq to dropping the ball in Afghanistan to oil prices to no bidding contracts for Halliburton to Cheney recieving deferred salary from Halliburton while he is office (hmmn) to administration reversal of opinion on status of detainees to Rep Arlen Spector trying to sue Pres Bush over the misuse of signing statements. And there is so much more......

 

 

 

Best

 

Tim

[timHealy]

How did I forget the wreckless spending spending spending.

 

best

 

Tim

[Alessandro Machi]

---Condi is the Secretary of State.

 

The State Department is the 'foreign office' not the 'home office'.

Foreign affairs rather than domestic affairs.

 

The duties of the Secretary of State from U.S. Department of State site:

 

Serves as the President?s principal adviser on U.S. foreign policy;

Conducts negotiations relating to U.S. foreign affairs;

Grants and issues passports to American citizens and exequaturs to foreign consuls in the United States;

Advises the President on the appointment of U.S. ambassadors, ministers, consuls, and other diplomatic representatives;

Advises the President regarding the acceptance, recall, and dismissal of the representatives of foreign governments;

Personally participates in or directs U.S. representatives to international conferences, organizations, and agencies;

Negotiates, interprets, and terminates treaties and agreements;

Ensures the protection of the U.S. Government to American citizens, property, and interests in foreign countries;

Supervises the administration of U.S. immigration laws abroad;

Provides information to American citizens regarding the political, economic, social, cultural, and humanitarian conditions in foreign countries;

Informs the Congress and American citizens on the conduct of U.S. foreign relations;

Promotes beneficial economic intercourse between the United States and other countries;

Administers the Department of State;

Supervises the Foreign Service of the United States.

 

In addition, the Secretary of State retains domestic responsibilities that Congress entrusted to the State Department in 1789. These include the custody of the Great Seal of the United States, the preparation of certain presidential proclamations, the publication of treaties and international acts as well as the official record of the foreign relations of the United States, and the custody of certain original treaties and international agreements. The Secretary also serves as the channel of communication between the Federal Government and the States on the extradition of fugitives to or from foreign countries.

 

http://www.state.gov/secretary/96.htm

 

New Orleans is not her beat. Something more like Brahms or Shostakovich.

 

Perhaps if New Orleans had ceded from the Union prior ti Katrina...

 

Sometimes it takes a few jabs to knock some sense into someone.

---LV

 

 

Do you recall that the United States immediately received communication from countries all over the world offering aid.

 

Rice would have been the one fielding those calls and offers for help, if she hadn't been shopping for shoes in New York, preparing for tennis lessons with a professional tennis player, etc.

[Matt Pacini]

Well, if I was more cynical, I could use the standard liberal tactic, of saying that all you guys criticizing Condi are automatically racist for doing so, because she's black.

Personally, I like her. She's doing her her job. Do you guys really expect her to all of a sudden rebel and start doing exactly what her boss doesn't want her to do?

And yes, she has nothing whatsoever to do with Katrina. Not every government employee functions as a propaganda device you know. I don't really care what she thinks about Katrina, that's not her job.

 

Hey, now this week in California it's COOLER than average.

I guess that must be PROOF we're now heading into an ice age, right?

I mean, last week I heard constant statements (and posts here) that OBVIOUSLY it being so hot was proof of gobal warming, so this HAS to be so, right?

 

MP

[Alessandro Machi]

Well, if I was more cynical, I could use the standard liberal tactic, of saying that all you guys criticizing Condi are automatically racist for doing so, because she's black.

Personally, I like her. She's doing her her job. Do you guys really expect her to all of a sudden rebel and start doing exactly what her boss doesn't want her to do?

And yes, she has nothing whatsoever to do with Katrina. Not every government employee functions as a propaganda device you know. I don't really care what she thinks about Katrina, that's not her job.

 

Hey, now this week in California it's COOLER than average.

I guess that must be PROOF we're now heading into an ice age, right?

I mean, last week I heard constant statements (and posts here) that OBVIOUSLY it being so hot was proof of gobal warming, so this HAS to be so, right?

 

MP

 

Rice's primary job is to communicate with other countries. This is a two way street. Not just to tell them what we are doing, but to listen to them when they need to speak to us. Other countries did want to speak to us after Hurricane Katrina, they WANTED TO OFFER THEIR HELP.

 

But Condoleeza Rice was on vacation shopping for shoes & planning tennis lessons while people in New Orleans were still on the rooves of their homes watching their neighbors furniture float on by as they hung onto their roof for dear life.

 

We all saw what a questionable job FEMA did. Would it have been so wrong to supplement what FEMA did or did not do with help from other countries who were offering help? WE'll never know becaise Condoleeza Rice did not deem it enough of an emergency to stay at work while citizens of New Orleans died waiting for help.

[Dan Goulder]

Well, if I was more cynical, I could use the standard liberal tactic, of saying that all you guys criticizing Condi are automatically racist for doing so, because she's black.

Instead, you've opted for the cynical "standard right-wing" tactic, which is to conjure up a repugnant position, and then hang it on some "liberal" straw man, conveniently overlooking the fact that no one on this forum has played on Condi's skin color but you.

[Jon-Hebert Barto]

I subscribe to many, many websites and email letters during the politcal season. Both "left" and "right". I'm pretty sure I got this from MOVEON.ORG during the last presidential bid. I searched and could not find it with moveon... so maybe I'm mistaken but it was not from this site, whitehouse.org.

 

In any event this "poster" was bundled at the bottom of said letter with other admin peeps in pure characature form. If not moveon then it was some other liberal blog(not associated with the DMC) that sent it to me. Anyhow, it is completely racist and not the least bit funny no matter what side of the political aisle you stand on, hopefully. This is, I think, what matt p. was thinking of when he wrote his "skin color" commentary. It is hard to tell what he is saying sometimes....I actually was shocked when a liberal site sent it to me in a email. :blink: 100% fringe movement! Bloggers are crazy!! :o

 

http://www.whitehouse.org/initiatives/post...ondi_whitey.asp

 

I don't really get offended easy, but DAMN...thats some harsh shite!

 

In regards to her job.....

 

Baker, Albright, poop....you need to go way back to find a good secretary of state. Powell could've been awesome if he just said no to the Bush kool-aid. I know he regrets it now...... :( <-Sad-face for you Powell. We could have had a beautiful relationship. Now your proud moderate legacy is in shambles. I still love you and hope we can get together soon some day, Colin. I know we'll have a good time then.... :)

 

-Jonnie Barto

[Tom Bays]

How about that environment.

[Andy_Alderslade]

Well, if I was more cynical, I could use the standard liberal tactic, of saying that all you guys criticizing Condi are automatically racist for doing so, because she's black.

Personally, I like her. She's doing her her job. Do you guys really expect her to all of a sudden rebel and start doing exactly what her boss doesn't want her to do?

And yes, she has nothing whatsoever to do with Katrina. Not every government employee functions as a propaganda device you know. I don't really care what she thinks about Katrina, that's not her job.

 

As said already, you're the only one here with enough racist disposition to bring up the issue of Rice's race.

 

Most liberals are probably only concerned with Rice's blatant lies over the connection of 9/11 and Iraq or her participation in shortsighted and irresponsible foreign policy which is destabilising much of the planet.

 

Hey, now this week in California it's COOLER than average.

I guess that must be PROOF we're now heading into an ice age, right?

I mean, last week I heard constant statements (and posts here) that OBVIOUSLY it being so hot was proof of gobal warming, so this HAS to be so, right?

 

Well if you want to throw out well researched scientific consensus (from dedicated scientists who have spent many years of their lives collecting data and reports for) for a simple fluctuation in the weather then thats your right, just don't expect anyone to respect your personal logic.

 

Global Warming is related to the rise in the Mean of Global Temperatures, not this year's heat wave. If the current weather is related to Global Warming then the current drop in temperature could easily be explained as in increase in eratic or unusual weather, which Global Warming is expected to initiate.

Edited August 2, 2006 by Andy_Alderslade

[Matt Pacini]

As said already, you're the only one here with enough racist disposition to bring up the issue of Rice's race.

Wow, talk about being blind to the obvious.

In this country, when anyone (other than a liberal) has ANYTHING negative to say about a black person, regardless of reason, they are accused of being a racist.

Only liberals get away with this, so that was my point.

For instance, Senator Robert Byrd (Democrat, a former KKK member) has used the dreaded N-word as recently as 2 years ago in a speech, yet not a peep from anyone, because he's a "good ol' boy" powerful Democrat.

A good example is the the recent hubub with the Democratic Senator (who happens to be a black woman), punches a cop who asked for her ID, and she and all her supporters, (including of course Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton), claim that it was all a racist conspiracy to "get her", even though nothing whatsoever happend to her because of it.

It obviously had nothing to do with race at all, but that's my point; she's black, someone had a problem with something she did; therefore that person was racist. Get the point?

 

So, I'm merely sarcastically using the same tactic to point out how absurd it is.

I obviously do not think everyone who doesn't like Condi is a racist. I'm just highlighting a double-standard, that's all.

And calling me a racist is funny. I'll have to tell that to my black brother-in-law, I'm sure he'll get a good laugh.

 

Hey, it's only 71 degrees at 11am today, so how about that ice age coming?

[Matt Pacini]

Oh, another thing. Blaming political figures for natural disasters is just ridiculous. Condi has nothing to do with FEMA.

 

And the piss-poor job that FEMA did, added with all the fraud from them just handing out money to anyone who asked for it, is a good example of why people should not depend on the federal government for everything that goes wrong in life.

It's a great example of exactly why this socialist utopia that people somehow fantasize about just really doesn't work out.

How many examples of this kind of thing do you need to come to this conclusion?

When you put gigantic governing bodies in charge of problems, (as opposed to small, local bodies), it turns into a gigantic cluster-f**k.

It's a good reason the federal government should be doing LESS, not more in these situations.

What actually happened with Katrina, is that the federal government got in the way of local governments and volunteers, and this didn't surprise me one bit. It's inherent with any large organization, but especially governmental bodies.

The pathetic thing about it is, this always happens during a crisis, then the opposing party always points fingers to get maximum political benefit from it, and all the shee-ple line up like good little mindless morons and believe the propaganda, and conclude that it's Bush's fault, it's Condi's fault, it's Clinton's fault, etc., etc.

 

The fault is that the larger an organization gets, the LESS responsive it is to people because it's so huge and bogged down that damn near nothing ever actually gets accomplished, but at great cost.

 

MP

[Alessandro Machi]

Oh, another thing. Blaming political figures for natural disasters is just ridiculous. Condi has nothing to do with FEMA.

 

MP

 

Nobody blamd the hurricane on the government. Do you seriously believe someone has?

 

Other countries offered tangible, useful and swift aid. Rice's job duties includes communicating with the very people and countries that were offering help, yet Condoleeza Rice decided to go on vacation during and after Hurricane Katrina instead of being back in Washington fielding those calls from other countries and marshalling all of that help to help out Americans in need.

[timHealy]

Oh, another thing. Blaming political figures for natural disasters is just ridiculous. Condi has nothing to do with FEMA.

 

Your right. Blaming them for natural disasters is a mistake but blaming them for man made ones is completely legitimate. The first and major mistake was incorporating FEMA under the umbrella of Homeland Security which the people "in charge" did: the Bush Administration. FEMA was a very good autonomous emergency response agency with great experienced people before the administration screwed it up. Incorporating it into Homeland security bogged it down by politics and the "war on terror" where they wound up losing some of the experienced people that had made it great prior to Katrina and September 11th.

 

Exactly what kind of socilist utopian society are you going on about? Are you suggesting the government should do even less than they did with Katrina? Is it wrong to suggest that a country as wealthy and powerful as ours should leave people in a region who have suffered a major catastrophe where first responders, emergency services and hospitals may be at best overwhelmed at best and at worst wiped out themselves?

 

Perhaps you should have visited the New Orleans region to see the damage yourself. To see how badly peoples lives were wiped out for hundreds of miles in all directions.

 

And if I may, talking about how nice and cool Califronia is today after the record breaking heat last week is similiar to sticking your head in the sand. Last week a government national weather service called 2006 so far the hottest year ever recorded in the US since recordings were kept. And you think we should do nothing?

 

I'm glad you aren't a scientist or I might actually think your opinions were fact and we wouldn't have to worry about a thing.

 

Best

 

Tim

[timHealy]

I shot an interview with a Viet Nam Vet a few months before the Viet Nam Controversy hit the presidential race and he spoke of his anger at Kerry, it was the first I had heard of such a sentiment and I knew Kerry was headed for controversy, especially because he used his Viet Nam experiences to curry favor in the first few primaries, so the whole anti Kerry Viet Nam movement probably was a grass roots effort.

 

Perhaps Kerry didn't feel comfortable attacking George Bushes record since the attack on him was a grass roots effort not necessarily initiated by the Bush camp.

 

Ever hear of Karl Rove and his "work"? Do a Google or Yahoo search. PBS Frontline did a show on him call "The Architect" which can be seen on their website.

 

Best

 

Tim

[Matt Pacini]

"...Are you suggesting the government should do even less than they did with Katrina? Is it wrong to suggest that a country as wealthy and powerful as ours should leave people in a region who have suffered a major catastrophe where first responders, emergency services and hospitals may be at best overwhelmed at best and at worst wiped out themselves?

 

I'm suggesting that THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT do less, and the STATE GOVERNMENTS do more.

You know... the UNITED STATES of America?

The problem is people have stopped thinking of this country as The United States, and have started thinking of it as America - and that is what will get us a dictatorial government someday.

There was a reason it was set up as independent states, but of course, that's damn near irrelevant now.

Everyone read the 10th amendment to the Constitution:

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

If that was being honored, 85% of the federal government would cease to exist.

And as far as this "wealthy government" rubbish goes, have you noticed we are several trillion dollars in debt? We're nowhere near even being flat broke.

We are not a wealthy nation, by any rational measurement.

 

Hey, do you think Al Gore will be mentioning the fact that IT'S SNOWING IN AFRICA????

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060802/ap_on_...frica_cold_snap

 

Guess what, kids? The weather changes. It gets hotter some places, and it gets colder some places. It gets drying some places, and it gets wetter some places. There used to be glaciers right where I'm sitting now, in California.

It's easy to cherry-pick temperatures from only hot places, ignoring cold places.

I guess I gotta keep repeating this; IT'S ONLY GOTTEN ONE DEGREE HOTTER IN THE LAST 100 YEARS.

 

MP

[ken wood]

Don't confuse weather and climate.

[Robert Hughes]

I love that it's snowing in Johannesburg - it's about 99 and a half degrees in Washington...

[Andy_Alderslade]

We are not a wealthy nation, by any rational measurement.

 

The United States is the worlds richest nation, and that is a fact, that I doubt cold weather can question.

 

It holds 1/4 of the worlds wealth, and its population only accounts for 4% of the planets population total.

 

Thats not to say there arn't poor people in America, in contrast the US has extremes of rich and poor, far more than say than Germany or Japan, but non the less it remains an incredibly wealthy country.

 

Denial of ones wealth is just another trick of the rich to keep the poor without it.

[Alessandro Machi]

The United States is the worlds richest nation, and that is a fact, that I doubt cold weather can question.

 

It holds 1/4 of the worlds wealth, and its population only accounts for 4% of the planets population total.

 

Thats not to say there arn't poor people in America, in contrast the US has extremes of rich and poor, far more than say than Germany or Japan, but non the less it remains an incredibly wealthy country.

 

Denial of ones wealth is just another trick of the rich to keep the poor without it.

 

This reminds me of the comment above about not confusing weather with climate. We have individual wealth in this country but we are 10 TRILLION dollars in debt as a nation. The reason China wanted to buy into Unocal, the reason our ports were for sale is because other nations are getting nervous over the loans they have provided to our country, they want a tangible return to settle their own nerves.

 

It's also a myth that we give a lot of money, we are WAY DOWN on the list of countries that give money to other countries, AND, what we do list as "donations" to other countries involves the "donatiing" of weapons or military support.

[Matt Pacini]

Denial of ones wealth is just another trick of the rich to keep the poor without it.

 

Nice try. I live in a trailer park, and no, I'm not making it up. I'm keenly aware of the plight of the poor in this country, because I'm one of them.

I'm simply using an equally ridiculous statement to counter the absurd idea that we have so much extra cash floating around in this country, that we can throw it all at any problem that pops up and fix all the worlds problems.

I say we get the national debt down before we brag about how rich we are.

Maybe if everyone would stop sucking off the federal budget, my taxes would be lower and I could get out of the trailer park.

And there's another way to look at it; yes, we have wealth, but it's already been spent up for a couple genrations, by the federal government racking up insane debt.

If they sent everyone in the country a bill to cover the debt to get us back to zero, then you would see the reality of just how wealthy (or not) we actually are.

 

 

MP

[Brad Grimmett]

I'm simply using an equally ridiculous statement to counter the absurd idea that we have so much extra cash floating around in this country, that we can throw it all at any problem that pops up and fix all the worlds problems.

 

MP

We're already doing that, which is why we're so far in debt.

[Andy_Alderslade]

Nice try. I live in a trailer park, and no, I'm not making it up. I'm keenly aware of the plight of the poor in this country, because I'm one of them.

 

What can I say? I've accused one of your statements as having a racist inclination, when you say firmly you are not racist, and accused you of denial of your wealth when you say you actually are quite poor - I guess I don't understand you.

 

I can't comment on the level of your poverty, I live in a country very different for yours, where council housing and a national health service ensure a safety net, if not a particularly pretty one.

 

It still remains though that despite a gigantic National Dept, individual wealth, corporate wealth and Gross National Product still makes the United States incredibly rich. So the statement 'Don't confuse weather with Climate' is perhaps very appropriate.

 

What totally confuses me is why do you side with the Replublcian party on such issues of:

 

*Denial of Global Warming (against the oppinions of thousands of international scientists)

*Your Goverments slow and lacklustre response to Hurricane Katrina

*Condiliza Rice's carrying out of controvercial and arguably dangerous foreign policy

 

When you have such concerns over issues of:

 

*Natioinal Dept

*Making poor people pay taxes that keep them poor.

 

Which have been caused or incouraged by the US Replican Goverment's actions of:

 

*Going to war on shoddy intelligence causing an extremly expensive unnecessary war.

*Lacking transparrancy in contract negotiations e.g. The Haliburton 'The More you Spend the More we Pay you' contract.

*Spending billions on weapons manufacture when your homeland security could actually be improved by simple inexpensive measures such as increased Airport security where the cost would actually be paid for by the private firms involved i.e. Airliners.

*Massive corporate subsidies and tax breakes which could perhaps be better spent on the poor.

 

Even if you feel the Democrats will be just as bad, doesn't such levels of corruption and incompentence justify a change of house?

 

Denial of ones wealth is just another trick of the rich to keep the poor without it.

 

Can anyone guess where this quote came from?

Edited August 3, 2006 by Andy_Alderslade

[Tom Bays]

amazing

[Hal Smith]

Several have got my meaning of "not accepting flames" wrong. I meant I would ignore personal attacks by non-vets. I'm always willing to read other's opinions and think about them. I've gotten a bit testy about some of the personal attacks being flung around by creeps exactly like Dick Cheney - draft dodgers. The entire "Swift Boats" thing was disgraceful - and came out of Texas where politics is played as a blood sport.

[Alessandro Machi]

The entire "Swift Boats" thing was disgraceful - and came out of Texas where politics is played as a blood sport.

 

It's not that simple. Back in the 70's there was a debate between John Kerry and John O'Neill. That debate and what John Kerry said in Congress is what has festered among the swift boat people all of these years.

 

Here is a link of the transcript of that debate along with the reaction of the swift boat crowd.

 

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1186437/posts

 

The heat wave that was in California has now apparently hit the east coast. But is it climate change or is it a weather anomaly?