Does the short festival circuit even do anything?

[Guest]

As I've mentioned before…I have an industry friend who went from short film at TIFF, to directing an 85 million dollar studio film. His short opened doors for him, and he was recognized by WB and hired to direct this large scale movie.

 

Today he has completed three other studio features and his IMDB page shows, four other features, "announced."

 

I think he's probably the most successful person in the history of cinema in terms of having a short film at a festival and what came of it. And no he's not from LA, he's from Newfoundland Canada. (Once again disproving Tyler's oft spoken theory that one must move to LA in order to make things happen in the film business.)

 

Of course his story is statistically irrelevant, as I doubt anyone will duplicate his success. Then again…if you don't shoot and create then the only thing guaranteed to happen is…..nothing.

 

In 2017 people can create shorts on literally no budget, and get them into pubic view, heck even if you stuck it on YouTUBE or Vimeo, who knows what could happen?

 

R,

[Phil Rhodes]

 

 

who knows what could happen

 

Me, I'd be willing to bet.

[Guest]

 

Me, I'd be willing to bet.

 

 

Yes, the odds support you Phil.

 

I also fear that all film festivals have become nothing but a money grab for entry fees. Why would festivals try and heavily promote themselves to get more and more entries? Because the more entries, the more money they make in entry fees.

 

3500 entries a year to Sundance? Holy smokes!

 

I still maintain that the festivals do NOT watch every feature length entry from beginning to end. I simply can't believe that once the screener determines that the movie is a POS, after the first 10 mins, he's going to watch the remaining 80. Of course the festivals deny this up and down.

 

R,

[Justin Hayward]

 

3500 entries a year to Sundance?

 

 

 

Way more than that. The competition is high, but the quality is low. I think some of the naysayers aren't commenting on the odds of getting noticed with a short, but more commenting on the odds you'll make something good enough to get noticed. How often do we see something flat out amazing that goes totally unnoticed by anyone? More often than not the films that get into Sundance deserve to be there.

[Guest]

Hilariously Sundance started as a venue for the "independents" but like Cannes and TIFF, it has been completely hi-jacked by the Hollywood majors.

 

R,

[Justin Hayward]

The festival director recently admitted it's very difficult to get a feature into Sundance without a connection. But, the only reason it's difficult to get a short into Sundance is because they only accept about 0.5% of the entries. So it's got to be pretty good.

[Justin Hayward]

If you want to make a short and take it to a bunch of festivals, it's smart to tailor your story to a specific genre or topic and only submit to festivals that focus on that subject matter. You'll up your chances of getting in and up your chances of winning awards. I recently made a short targeted for children and we submitted to a bunch of children festivals. We got into almost everything we submitted to, won a handful of awards, and a bunch of prize money. This is random, but a friend of mine in college made a student film about over population. He submitted to a festival that focuses on stories about over population, and he won a thousand bucks... which in college may as well been a million :lol:

[George Ebersole]

If you want to make a short and take it to a bunch of festivals, it's smart to tailor your story to a specific genre or topic and only submit to festivals that focus on that subject matter. You'll up your chances of getting in and up your chances of winning awards. I recently made a short targeted for children and we submitted to a bunch of children festivals. We got into almost everything we submitted to, won a handful of awards, and a bunch of prize money. This is random, but a friend of mine in college made a student film about over population. He submitted to a festival that focuses on stories about over population, and he won a thousand bucks... which in college may as well been a million :lol:

 

Well, like I said, part of the idea of hitting the festival circuit, and by that I mean the non-Cannes indy venues, is to tack that festival on your resume. Even if you didn't win anything put a big old "Screened at Film Festival X" as a tagline. And if you do win, then that's just better copy for your DVD case or stream logo.

[Tyler Purcell]

As I've mentioned before…I have an industry friend who went from short film at TIFF, to directing an 85 million dollar studio film. His short opened doors for him, and he was recognized by WB and hired to direct this large scale movie.

That's called lightening in a bottle. It happens, I've seen it happen personally. However, I'm certain there is a lot more to the story then simply a random bloke submitting a short and making millions. Everyone I know who made the transition, spent a crazy amount of money on their short and doing everything a feature film would do, like hiring festival and even sales agents to make sure it wasn't a waste of time. Most people who make short films, can't afford those things, hence the reason they're making shorts.

 

Ohh and your comment about needing to live in Los Angeles. For every 1 lightening in a bottle that happens each year, there are 1000 people moving up the food chain here in L.A. So sure, you can waste your parents retirement fund on making a movie and going to festivals, to perhaps get lightening in a bottle... or you can move to one of the 'industry cities' and make product all day, every day, until your good enough to warrant spending money.

 

Again, if you have money and you can fine tune your craft, it doesn't matter where you live. Most people simply can't afford to have a full-time job outside of the industry AND fine tune their craft. This is why people move to industry cities in order to get work that relates to their passion.

[Guest]

there are 1000 people moving up the food chain here in L.A.

 

 

Well Tyler…I'm still based in Horseshoe Valley Ontario and I am making feature film number 5. You are based in LA and have made zero features. Of course we've discussed this point before. :)

 

I have thought about moving to LA, then I can keep in contact with everyone via phone and email, just like I do……now.

 

R,

[Phil Rhodes]

Richard, as we've discussed before, it isn't really about making the film. It's about selling it. Most of us are not in a position to sell feature films and we never will be.

 

P

[Guest]

Well distribution is always a challenge, and is a whole different game.

 

I know you don't buy my story about how I sold Dark Reprieve, but, that's how it happened.

 

R,

[Max Field]

As I've mentioned before…I have an industry friend who went from short film at TIFF, to directing an 85 million dollar studio film. His short opened doors for him, and he was recognized by WB and hired to direct this large scale movie.

What's the short? I'd like to more specifically see what studios find appealing in shorts.

Edited April 14, 2017 by Macks Fiiod

[Phil Rhodes]

I'm not sure you've ever really told us, that being the trick.

[Tyler Purcell]

Well Tyler…I'm still based in Horseshoe Valley Ontario and I am making feature film number 5. You are based in LA and have made zero features. Of course we've discussed this point before. :)

Sure and you are lightening in a bottle. You are one of maybe a dozen filmmakers each year who find their way through the maze.

 

There are literally thousands of filmmakers who spend years making good products, that will never consider themselves professional filmmakers because they never got lucky enough. Most of them have desk jobs and filmmaking is a hobby. At least living in So Cal, filmmaking is how people pay their bills, so it's just a matter of time before something you make, gets you recognition. You don't have to re-mortgage the home, you don't need to beg money from friends, you don't need to max out credit cards, you don't even need a great script. If you work hard, if you do good work within the industry, you will be successful eventually. How long it takes, does matter on how good you are and some luck. This is a reason why people live in "media cities", not saying LA is the only one because it's not. New York, Chicago, Atlanta, these are also media cities. .

 

I have thought about moving to LA, then I can keep in contact with everyone via phone and email, just like I do……now.

Well sure, you have really nothing to do with this subject. You've already progressed above the level of short subject filmmaker. Most filmmakers don't live in L.A. because they don't need to, they've progressed to a higher level. If I was in your position, with a good distribution chain, I'd live somewhere entire different too. Unfortunately, most of us aren't in that position, so we live where the work is.

[Guest]

I'm not sure you've ever really told us, that being the trick.

 

 

I explained it in detail on a thread long ago, but of course you quickly dismissed it. NP.

 

R,

[Guest]

What's the short? I'd like to more specifically see what studios find appealing in shorts.

 

 

You'd have better luck predicting the winning lotto numbers. If there was a "formula" everyone would us it.

 

R,

[Tyler Purcell]

Well, there is a formula... I've written it down and pretty much everyone follows it pretty closely.

 

If you don't have any money, following the formula is impossible. So finding the money is actually the hardest part, once you've got it, the rest is pretty much in the formula.

[Phil Rhodes]

I can't help but conclude on the available evidence that regardless of the quality or content of the production, actually getting to the point of having sold the damn thing is dependent almost entirely on personal contacts and whose pool party you went to growing up.

 

I hate to go down the route of wondering whether this ultimately explains Hollywood's quality problem, but I can't help it.

[Guest]

Well, there is a formula... I've written it down and pretty much everyone follows it pretty closely.

 

 

Sorry Tyler, I'm going to call that comment pretty much ridiculous. We can't have young people coming on here and taking that comment seriously.

 

R,

[Phil Rhodes]

I think the part about not being able to follow said formula without a lot of money behind you is pretty accurate, though.

[Justin Hayward]

Maybe, but lots of money doesn't make a good script, which is something people often like to learn the hard way.

[Justin Hayward]

 

 

Sorry Tyler, I'm going to call that comment pretty much ridiculous. We can't have young people coming on here and taking that comment seriously.

 

R,

 

Oh come on Richard, You're on feature number 5. You should know how easy this is! :lol:

[Adrian Sierkowski]

Maybe, but lots of money doesn't make a good script, which is something people often like to learn the hard way.

Since when did you have to have a good script to be successful?

[Phil Rhodes]

You took the words out of my mouth.