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Vincent Sweeney

Dark Knight Rises, no 3D and in IMAX

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I went to see Mission Impossible 4, yesterday. I found out that the 8 minute 'The Dark Knight Rises' intro is only showing in 15/70 'ANALOG' IMAX theaters. I was then told that

dozens of digital IMAX theaters will TEMPORARILY switch batch to 15/70 to screen the new BATMAN film. I smiled a very big smile upon hearing that. They did show the latest trailer for the new film, it does look alot more interesting than the YOUTUBE behind the scenes footage and publicity photos. When I heard about the temporary changeover to 15/70, it confirmed my perception that Chris Nolan is dedicated to giving the audience a high quality and unique cinema experience. Rock On, my dude. B)

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I went to see Mission Impossible 4, yesterday. I found out that the 8 minute 'The Dark Knight Rises' intro is only showing in 15/70 'ANALOG' IMAX theaters. I was then told that

dozens of digital IMAX theaters will TEMPORARILY switch batch to 15/70 to screen the new BATMAN film. I smiled a very big smile upon hearing that. They did show the latest trailer for the new film, it does look alot more interesting than the YOUTUBE behind the scenes footage and publicity photos. When I heard about the temporary changeover to 15/70, it confirmed my perception that Chris Nolan is dedicated to giving the audience a high quality and unique cinema experience. Rock On, my dude. B)

 

 

How was the quality of the presentation?

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I really hope it's true that they will temporarily switch back to 15/70. I was so pissed when I saw Inception at my formerly-IMAX-equipped theater only to find it was digital LIEMAX. Maybe they learned a lesson from that one? I'm prepared for that not to be the case, though, and I'm gonna make the drive to LA to see the real thing.

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Could you explain exactly what the difference is between IMAX 15/70 and IMAX Digital?

 

15/70

 

= true film acquisition on 15 perf pull down IMAX stock (or should I say pull-sideways)

 

FREAKING COOL - I personally find it waaaaay more immersive than 3D could ever get.

 

 

liemax - any other acquisition format printed on IMAX projection stock for presentation

 

...as good as the acquisition format - i.e. the resolution is 2k and lower for instance in many high speed camera sequences

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I really hope it's true that they will temporarily switch back to 15/70. I was so pissed when I saw Inception at my formerly-IMAX-equipped theater only to find it was digital LIEMAX. Maybe they learned a lesson from that one? I'm prepared for that not to be the case, though, and I'm gonna make the drive to LA to see the real thing.

 

Throw a dozen eggs at the projection window, then go get your money back!

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liemax - any other acquisition format printed on IMAX projection stock for presentation

 

...as good as the acquisition format - i.e. the resolution is 2k and lower for instance in many high speed camera sequences

 

I often hear people using the term liemax in relation to IMAX digital too which is just the IMAX version of 2k digital projection.

 

love

 

Freya

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15/70

 

= true film acquisition on 15 perf pull down IMAX stock (or should I say pull-sideways)

 

FREAKING COOL - I personally find it waaaaay more immersive than 3D could ever get.

 

liemax - any other acquisition format printed on IMAX projection stock for presentation

 

...as good as the acquisition format - i.e. the resolution is 2k and lower for instance in many high speed camera sequences

 

Thank you for clearing that up. And I agree that superb IMAX wipes the floor with any 3D presentation.

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actually, I should provisionally extend the definition of liemax:

 

... maybe they go so far as to simply project from any projector (35mm, digital) onto a IMAX screen and thereby still call it IMAX.

 

Can anyone confirm this has happened to them ?

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actually, I should provisionally extend the definition of liemax:

 

... maybe they go so far as to simply project from any projector (35mm, digital) onto a IMAX screen and thereby still call it IMAX.

 

Can anyone confirm this has happened to them ?

 

I watched Indy 4 at the Imax in Siam Paragon in Bangkok Thailand in 2008 and that was 35mm simply blown up to fill the Imax screen it was softer than a babies ass.Walked away very disappointed.

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I watched Indy 4 at the Imax in Siam Paragon in Bangkok Thailand in 2008 and that was 35mm simply blown up to fill the Imax screen it was softer than a babies ass.Walked away very disappointed.

 

Sure the 35mm shots were put through DMR after being scanned at 4K resolution from the timed master positive. The IMAX shots were probably 15-20 minutes worth of footage 2nd generation contact prints at all IMAX theatres, or scanned at it was at least 8K for SFX work and then output back to film and contact printed.

 

 

 

This latest "Dark Knight" installment is supposed to have more IMAX.

 

While some IMAX theatres are running a smaller frame size, believe it is 8-perf., the vast majority of real film installations run 70mm 15-perf. It certainly is up to the cinematographer (and those over him) what is put onto IMAX film. It can only resolve 12K+ if it is in-focus and shot on IMAX negative.

 

Even 4K DMR onto film, this should look far better than a pair of 2K projectors. At 3.6K+ (probably really close to 4 even through two film generations considering the 12x area of an IMAX frame compared with 4-perforation 35mm), this is still almost double the resolution at any digital equivalent.

 

Consider also screen size and brightness, even against true 4K projectors, which often have brightness issues.

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Sure the 35mm shots were put through DMR after being scanned at 4K resolution from the timed master positive. The IMAX shots were probably 15-20 minutes worth of footage 2nd generation contact prints at all IMAX theatres, or scanned at it was at least 8K for SFX work and then output back to film and contact printed.

Brian was talking about Indy 4. There never were IMAX prints of that one, so when he said ”35mm simply blown up”, he probably meant actual 35mm projection on an IMAX screen. No wonder that was soft; it was just a 2K DI film, to make matters worse.

 

While some IMAX theatres are running a smaller frame size, believe it is 8-perf., the vast majority of real film installations run 70mm 15-perf.

All film-based IMAX projectors are 15/70mm. 8/70mm is a separate format, used in science centres etc. and not branded by IMAX, even though a lot of 15/70mm ”science/ride” films also had 8/70mm reduction prints made.

 

Most of the DMR releases of Hollywood blockbusters were always 15/70mm only. Disney made 8/70mm prints of The Beauty and the Beast, Treasure Planet and The Lion King, but those are the only feature films for that format as far as I know.

 

Regarding The Dark Knight Rises, the producer said in December that there will be 40–50 minutes of IMAX-shot footage. Also, there was some talk earlier that Nolan is considering shooting the rest of the film in 5-perf 65mm – I don’t know what’s the latest news on that but it sounds good. B)

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Most of the DMR releases of Hollywood blockbusters were always 15/70mm only.

Actually, I suppose that there never was such a thing as a 8/70mm DMR. IMAX DMR is a trademarked process which has only been used for making 15/70mm prints and digital IMAX DCP’s (although I suppose those are two quite different processes really). So the Disney 8/70mm blowups were just… well, blowups.

Edited by Antti Näyhä

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Brian was talking about Indy 4. There never were IMAX prints of that one, so when he said ”35mm simply blown up”, he probably meant actual 35mm projection on an IMAX screen. No wonder that was soft; it was just a 2K DI film, to make matters worse.

 

 

I thought he was talking about an IMAX print, regardless of the movie there should be a 70mm projector in an IMAX booth (well unless it is "IMAX" digital. . .)

 

 

 

No offense, but I really think you are nitpicking me.

 

The point I was trying to make is that an IMAX blowup of a 35mm movie should look really good, but from an IMAX neg will look a lot better, and, either way, a film IMAX presentation will look better than just a couple of crummy 2K projectors with an IMAX logo stamped on them ;)

 

That's optical DMR, 8 perf. 15 perf., whatever. 70mm blowups look better than 35mm, unless the projector's out of focus during the duplicating process.

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Personally, I was never a fan of the 35mm-to-15/70mm DMR process. If the film was shot on 35mm, I’d rather watch a good 35mm projection of a good print. Or a 4K digital projection.

 

That said, some of the optical, non-DMR 35mm-to-5/70mm blowups I’ve seen have looked really good. When IMAX came up with DMR, they introduced all sorts of digital grain reduction and sharpening. I understand that those things might be unavoidable to make the footage watchable on a 130-foot screen, but I still prefer it on a smaller screen – with nice, natural grain instead of DMR artifacts.

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A 35mm print loses roughly 30% of the negative (not to mention the dynamic range in the highlights, shadows that are obliterated in a high-contrast print), in a 4th generation contact print.

 

I'd say that a 4K DMR is less than 5%, maybe more like 2-3% because the resolution of the negative far exceeds the information that has been blown up on it. I'd say IMAX blowups, optical or digital, come close to 4K projection, definitely with better colors and contrast ratios.

 

 

 

Just FYI most "4K projectors" show movies through 3D lenses (less than 2K resolution) or only have 2K files even if they DO have the right lens. For practical purposes film IMAX decimates its current digital competition.

 

I personally dislike grain reduction, but that is another can of worms. It can be applied just as oppressively to a 4K DI master.

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Brian was talking about Indy 4. There never were IMAX prints of that one, so when he said ”35mm simply blown up”, he probably meant actual 35mm projection on an IMAX screen. No wonder that was soft; it was just a 2K DI film, to make matters worse.

 

 

The cinema actually advertised that this was a special Imax Presentation, f@cking insult more like.

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