Here's a new one: cinematograpy and dating

[Brian Rose]

Okay, this one is sort of outta left field, but one that has proven increasingly problematic for me. My own experience has been that dating has proven exceptionally difficult when pursuing cinematography, or heck, cinema in general. 1) the hours can be long, especially when you're getting started and have to "put in your time." When you're so exhausted you have barely the energy to eat, where you dream of crashing in bed, making time to pursue and maintain a relationship can be difficult.

 

And second, there is the problem of gender balance. Sadly, it is a fact that there are not as many women in our field. In all my years working, I've encountered all of one female who was pursuing a technical background. So while in just about every field, where one benefits from daily interaction with both sexes, where there is greater opportunity for finding a relationship, in our field, this rule breaks down. Not to mention there is the issue of professional conduct, and a line which many won't cross. For the production company with which I do a lot of freelance work, there is a production manager who I was interested in, but she let on early that she doesn't date those with which we works professionally. It was a disappointment, but ultimately wise, because if a relationship goes sour, it makes future work for the same people awkward, and if it goes bad during an actual production, all the worse.

 

Not to mention, there simply isn't time. Everyone is hustling around, everyone has a job to do, and then when the job is done, we all scatter and never do the twain meet. Our lives are very compartmentalized, and it makes dating damn difficult.

 

Of course this leads to the big problem of just WHEN and HOW one tries to date and build a relationship, if there isn't time when you're on hours, and when you're off..you're too tired.

 

Yet all that activity doesn't fill the void. It can be damn lonely coming home after a hard day, and wishing you had someone with which you could unwind about your troubles, to enjoy the evening with, to share a bed at night. I just don't know how to get there. It shames me to admit it, but I'm 27 and I've never had a girlfriend, and the number of dates I've had can be counted on one hand. For me it is more complex...I'm a bit shy, not the best with words or mannerisms...it's why I drifted toward film, because it felt in a way more natural a form of communication than verbal for me.

But admittedly, while my work is a solution, it is also a problem and I fear it risks becoming an obstruction, for the reasons I laid out above.

 

So to get to the point, how have the rest of you dealt with this? How did you find that balance between propelling your career forward, and satisfying the basic needs we all have for companionship and love? How do you maintain a well rounded life, and a healthy relationship despite the incredible demands of our metier?

 

Best,

BR

[Brian Drysdale]

I think the saying goes don't date your camera assistant, but everything else is OK. I know lots of film & TV people who date and have married people within the industry and sometimes with whom they work. In any industry, it's one of the most common ways of people meeting and having a relationship. A production manager would have a different working relationship to other grades, so that could be a professional decision.

 

Remember, nepotism rules.

[Chris Millar]

Sounds like you haven't met the right person yet - when you do, there aint no 'too tired at the end of the day' ...

[David Mullen ASC]

Sounds like you haven't met the right person yet - when you do, there aint no 'too tired at the end of the day' ...

 

You're not my age... ;)

 

I got lucky -- I met my wife when we were 22, in college, and we've been together now for 27 years.

[John Holland]

Older than you David and you have done a lot better than me . Married twice , i am a good boy now . about time .

[Marcus Joseph]

I do think dating anyone in the film industry would be incredibly difficult to spend time together once you are away working on different jobs for example. I sometimes wonder about actresses and their perception towards the cinematographer, or the guy who can make them look good. I do have memory of history where cinematographers had famous relationships, I think even a camera operator is married to Julia Roberts.

[Tom Jensen]

Did you hear about the actress that was so dumb she slept with the writer?

[K Borowski]

Marcus, would give your comment a "like" were this not Cinematography.com :-)

 

 

I forget but I think some Canadian grip or camera op or maybe it was a gaffer hooked up with some famous actress and married her!

 

 

I'm gong to take this approach myself! I want an intelligent attractive actress though, not just eye candy :-D I had wanted to take David's approach. Alas, I went to the wrong college for that it seems. Wasn't in the cards.

 

 

I would take it out of your department Brian, not because of the whole "don't sh** where you eat" thing, but more because there are very few *straight* girls in the camera department, in my experience, and they get bombarded with male hormones.

 

I still remember poor Annie getting oggled over the internet when she was on here. Paul Bruenning, not to disrespect the dead, was following her around on here with his tongue out, same with James Steven Beverly. BTW what has happened to him lately? Notice he hasn't been on here much. Must've sold out and gotten a real job :-(

Edited July 4, 2011 by K Borowski

[Chris Millar]

Woah Karl...

 

2 x "Its not good manners"

 

 

 

David - I'm somewhere between your age and Brians - when I was his age I was both at Uni full time and working 32hrs a week backstage in theatre and had pneumonia when I met my partner, I found time !!

 

Once you meet the right person the energy comes in spades (no pun intended at all actually but I'm thinking of that Smiths song 'Pretty Girls Make Graves" )

[K Borowski]

?

 

Sorry if it is not politically correct, but, objectively, quantitatively, I have worked with mostly lesbian female ACs. And I don't have a problem with them at all, haven't said anything derogatory with regards to gay or straight female cameramen in this industry; so what is the problem? Many famous female photographers are of that inclination as well. I'm not going to write a disclaimer to go with this either. It's what I've observed and maybe your experiences differ, but I find that unlikely.

 

What am I supposed to do, not mention it because of the sensitivity of the issue? I just want Brian to know that his chances at finding a significant other in the camera department are lower than it would first appear :-D

 

 

What's the other issue you have?

[Brian Drysdale]

I would take it out of your department Brian, not because of the whole "don't sh** where you eat" thing, but more because there are very few *straight* girls in the camera department, in my experience, and they get bombarded with male hormones.

 

There's certainly a tomboy element to the female camera assistants I know, although quite a few of them have gone on to have created a family in a straight manner.

[K Borowski]

I never assume. A lot of people think I am gay, and Jewish! (straight as an arrow, lapsed Roman Catholic, they should be able to guess the latter with my being in the "Ski Club" if they know me by name)

 

These are girls that have said to me "I'm a lesbian." They outnumber the straight ones I have worked with (or who haven't told me they are gay.)

 

 

 

I still don't get what the other of the 2x issue was.

 

I get in a surprising amount of trouble for being blunt, and honest. This is to help Brian, not be PC.

[Matthew W. Phillips]

Could it be, Karl, that you were told that because they were just not interested in you? It does happen.

 

Also, The only thing I took offense about was the remark about Paul. He was a married man and happily, I presume. I think he was just a friendly guy who liked to help people.

[Brian Drysdale]

I get in a surprising amount of trouble for being blunt, and honest. This is to help Brian, not be PC.

 

I expect there are a few bi ones as well. I think you just have to accept people as they are. Nearly wrote something else and then realised the double entendre.

[K Borowski]

"I think you just have to accept people as they are."

 

I completely agree; can you give me an example of how, in any way, I indicated or demonstrated anything to the contrary?

 

 

 

Have never made a pass on an AC Matthew; I could find examples of what I said about Paul. It's very childish what you said, tee hee hee maybe they said they were gay because I was interested in them, sure man. I know married men that slap barmaids on the hind quarters and stuff bills down their shirts. Not that what Paul did was to that level, but he certainly was flirtatious. Anyway, I thought we are getting completely off topic, so can we please, for Brian's sake if not mine, disperse with the lynch mob and get back on topic?

 

I'm sorry I even brought up a very obvious common working condition in many male-dominated technical fields, including camera departments.

[Chris Millar]

?

 

Sorry if it is not politically correct, but, objectively, quantitatively, I have worked with mostly lesbian female ACs. And I don't have a problem with them at all, haven't said anything derogatory with regards to gay or straight female cameramen in this industry; so what is the problem? Many famous female photographers are of that inclination as well. I'm not going to write a disclaimer to go with this either. It's what I've observed and maybe your experiences differ, but I find that unlikely.

 

What am I supposed to do, not mention it because of the sensitivity of the issue? I just want Brian to know that his chances at finding a significant other in the camera department are lower than it would first appear :-D

 

 

What's the other issue you have?

 

Its just not polite to talk about people like that esp. naming them ...

 

Not saying its wrong or right - just impolite ;)

[Matthew W. Phillips]

Have never made a pass on an AC Matthew; I could find examples of what I said about Paul. It's very childish what you said, tee hee hee maybe they said they were gay because I was interested in them, sure man. ...Not that what Paul did was to that level, but he certainly was flirtatious.

 

I guess I was gone a lot from this board and didn't get to see that side of Paul so I suppose I stand corrected.

 

I wasn't trying to be childish. Just assumed you found out they were gay because you made a pass. Otherwise, it seemed quite awkward if I imagine the exchange:

 

Karl: Hey, Lisa, how are you today?

Lisa: I'm great and a lesbian...how about you?

 

I am sorry if I came off as childish but remember, not being PC goes both ways ;)

[Sean Lambrecht]

It's very difficult to find someone in your own department, I've found. Perhaps we need cinepersonals.com? I'll start it out:

 

The Cantankerous Gayffer

 

Male

 

5'9"

 

140#

 

Seeking same to share lighting packages. Wardrobe, Makeup, and especially Actors need not apply. Must like cheap beer.

[Brian Drysdale]

It's very difficult to find someone in your own department, I've found. Perhaps we need cinepersonals.com? I'll start it out:

 

I thought the sparks were picking up all the women, between lighting set ups they somehow seem to manage a fair amount of flirting.

[Adrian Sierkowski]

I don't know where all of you people have been, but somehow there are always very attractive young women on sets I work on. Generally I'd have my nice to look at 1AC, So far they've all be women, though seem to be interested more in indi directors, The make up artist (bad idea, every day they look differant and some fake blood doesn't wash out) , production designers (not bad idea, they'll decorate your house as "practice," but often you'll be missing things only yo see them later in rushes), PAs (can make coffee and lock up the street for you to find a parking spot) and I'm sure many others... Editors especially seem to be woman in my experience... well perhaps assistant editors.

 

IN truth, though, It might be a much better idea to date someone who ISN'T in the industry and hence is why god made bars and match.com. If anything one should hope to find a nice normal person with a stable job who can see you as a bit of adventure from their mundane world. This person will love you for you of course, but will also help out by having work and money when times are slow.... just my perspective... (and of course I wind up dating an artist.... but she can make coffee and that's all I ask)

[John Sprung]

..., I think even a camera operator is married to Julia Roberts.

 

Yes, Danny Moder. I worked with his father, Mike, who was a UPM and later a production executive. Good guy, but I never met the kids.

 

 

 

 

-- J.S.

[Chris Millar]

Some revealing attitudes here ...

 

I'm outta of this thread

[K Borowski]

 

I wasn't trying to be childish. Just assumed you found out they were gay because you made a pass. Otherwise, it seemed quite awkward if I imagine the exchange:

 

Karl: Hey, Lisa, how are you today?

Lisa: I'm great and a lesbian...how about you?

 

I am sorry if I came off as childish but remember, not being PC goes both ways ;)

 

I am sorry to hijack this thread, but I want to clear the air here, since you want to follow me around now criticizing me, Matthew. IDK how this has anything to do with being PC, being childish.

 

Now you're following me from thread to thread. If you want to "duke off in the back alley" let's do it like men, off of other people's threads, OK? Truce? As for Paul, he and I had a falling out, he died, but now it has been a year and I am not going to bite my tongue and pretend he didn't do these things. I didn't specifically single him out; thought he was divorced at the time, anyway, so don't even see how I disparaged his integrity if he was single at the time. . .

[Matthew W. Phillips]

I am sorry to hijack this thread, but I want to clear the air here, since you want to follow me around now criticizing me, Matthew.

 

Karl, I'm not following you around and wanting to "take out out back" or however you put it. I have respect for you and you are a straight shooter which is honorable. But there is a time and a place for that and Paul was a friend of mine. Sometimes with friends, you can know something is true but you still dont want to hear someone say it. I have argued with a lot of you guys, you included Karl, but I still wouldn't want others insulting any of you. I've talked more with a lot of you on here than I ever have with people I've actually worked with.

[James Steven Beverly]

 

I still remember poor Annie getting oggled over the internet when she was on here. Paul Bruenning, not to disrespect the dead, was following her around on here with his tongue out, same with James Steven Beverly. BTW what has happened to him lately? Notice he hasn't been on here much. Must've sold out and gotten a real job :-(

 

Actually Karl, I liked Annie, she was a nice person that I enjoyed posting with and tried to help when I could. I'm sorry she's not here anymore. I ended up doing some business with her when she was selling some of her grip tape and such. Except for a few emails we exchanged while we were working out the deal on the expendables, that was pretty much it.

 

Physically,from the few pics I saw of her, to be honest, she wasn't really my type. See, I tend to gravitate to tall blonds with classic features, the Nicole Kidman, Grace Kelly type. Annie was more cute pixie type with dark hair. We were friendly online much as I am with Freya or Hal.

 

Though I'm not 100% certain, I don't think what I did could really be construed as internet stalking. Of course should you feel I'm acting inappropriately in YOUR opinion at some point in the future, don't hesitate to voice your concerns. ;)

 

And, no, I haven't "sold out" nor gotten a "real" job. As a matter of fact, I just locked the feature length instructional video I produced and directed a month or so ago which should be available at the Southwest Gear website

 

http://www.southwestgear.com/swg/

 

sometime in August. We're looking for ways to expand distribution and are getting ready for pre-production on the second one in the series.

 

I've also been preparing for my planned trip to AFM in November, where I'm gonna shop around a few scripts and try to secure foreign sales commitments that I might be able to leverage into getting a commitment from a star or at least a name actor or two which MAY help me to get the money to do a narrative feature.

 

I also have been working to get my other business, the hotrod and racecar fabrication business up and rolling...so to speak. I've spent a lot of time organizing, cleaning and securing equipment for the enterprise, which, considering all the crap I have in there, is literally a Herculean task that has already cost me 2 months or more of work and looks like I might be going at it for another 2 months. It's a real pain

 

Aside from being insanely busy, another reason I haven't been posting as much is I guess I also haven't needed to ask as many questions as I used to. I've learned A LOT here and elsewhere so now can answer a lot of my own questions.

 

I do usually check and see if there are any interesting discussions going on 3 or 4 times a week minimum and post once in a while but lately much of the discussion has related to video and as I prefer film, nothing has really caught my fancy so I haven't had all that much to say. So that's the story. B)