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Matt Thomas

Can we talk about "The Crown"?

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I have not yet seen 'The Crown', but given that its from Netflix - it's probably a good series. As for how it looks - the cinematography is okay, but it also feels somewhat soap-operishly flat to me. Maybe its just the fact that the look never seems to change under any circumstances. I personally like cinematography that switches up a bit where appropriate - and the problem here is that all the light setups appear the same.

 

I know that seems like I'm nitpicking it, and maybe I am... But it still looks good, maybe even great in a few cases - but it just feels someone flat to me. Maybe once I get around to watching the series I can judge from something other than the trailer, and change my mind.

Edited by Landon D. Parks

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I've heard the term, "every frame a painting" before but damn! Screen grabs from this season could be hung in museums without anyone noticing.

 

It's certainly no Barry Lyndon. I dunno, it looks fine, I suppose, but it's rather, "here it is," as Landon mentions, it feels very static, like a larger budget, sharpening turned down version, of days of our lives, in real locations.

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I have not yet seen 'The Crown', but given that its from Netflix - it's probably a good series. As for how it looks - the cinematography is okay, but it also feels somewhat soap-operishly flat to me. Maybe its just the fact that the look never seems to change under any circumstances.

 

It's hard to see how you can draw that conclusion from a 2 minute trailer for a show you haven't watched.

 

The show is characterized by low key, hazed interiors. Lots of mixed color temps. Large soft sources, with rich shadows. In other words, the polar opposite of a soap opera.

 

There are parts of it which are set in Africa, which has a very different look photographically than Pre-war London. Other parts are set onboard the Royal yacht, and have an almost Kodachrome look to them.

 

Photographically, i think the show is beautiful. They have worked hard to create different looks, and stuck by them. Season 2 has evolved even further in its depiction of post-war London.

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It's hard to see how you can draw that conclusion from a 2 minute trailer for a show you haven't watched.

 

Exactly, which is why I made that known here "Maybe once I get around to watching the series I can judge from something other than the trailer, and change my mind."

 

There is just something about what I see in the trailer that just doesn't pop out to me.

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I don't mean to say it looks bad, it just doesn't stick out as particular impressive to me. Perhaps 'flat' was the wrong word to use. It looks average, much like other similar drama series. They all seem to be overly heavy on the HBM filters, warmly-lit, teal-orange graded, and very conservative camera angles. Then again, I never was a fan of the 'dramatic' cinematography look. For something to be impressive to me, it needs to do something out of the ordinary, which I why I said it looks good, but not impressive.

 

Perhaps I'll regret my words once I see the show. The trailer itself doesn't show much variation.

Edited by Landon D. Parks

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And ..drum roll.. Tyler and Sam.. its shot with an F55... so at least there is one DP in the world who can defeat Sony's strange in built self sabotage codec and sensor.. :).

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And ..drum roll.. Tyler and Sam.. its shot with an F55... so at least there is one DP in the world who can defeat Sony's strange in built self sabotage codec and sensor.. :).

 

When you put our names together I feel like I should be in 1973 with Philip Glenister yelling in my face.

 

F55, is that like an old FS7?

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And ..drum roll.. Tyler and Sam.. its shot with an F55... so at least there is one DP in the world who can defeat Sony's strange in built self sabotage codec and sensor.. :).

Robin, it's obvious that they spent most of the $150m budget on a superstar colorist who was able to 'save' the show. Thank god!

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Sam.. yes pretty much an old fs7.. :).. yeah who ever did post on that show must be driving a Ferrari .. got rid of the green somehow.. saved their arses after they chose a very sub par camera.. and then they did it again for S2.. idiots.. when the new Ursa is available.. personally I cant see why they didn't go with the pocket.. fools..

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Sam.. yes pretty much an old fs7.. :).. yeah who ever did post on that show must be driving a Ferrari .. got rid of the green somehow.. saved their arses after they chose a very sub par camera.. and then they did it again for S2.. idiots.. when the new Ursa is available.. personally I cant see why they didn't go with the pocket.. fools..

 

So the FS7 is a newer model of the F55. Interesting. I'm glad they took the green out of it. Does the FS7 also have a hue issue?

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So the FS7 is a newer model of the F55. Interesting. I'm glad they took the green out of it. Does the FS7 also have a hue issue?

 

The fs7 like the new Venice .. has a special electronic "Tokyo Green" filter, that actually forms part of the sensor itself.. its organic and derived from Wakame.. seaweed to you guys.. Cant say much as I was part of the team and its taken 10 years to get to this stage.. alot of priority software stuff going on..growing the sea weed in hidden bunkers deep beneath Tokyo.. obviously legally I cant give much away here.. but we are of course really excited with whats happening..I will give up dates when possible..

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The fs7 like the new Venice .. has a special electronic "Tokyo Green" filter, that actually forms part of the sensor itself.. its organic and derived from Wakame.. seaweed to you guys.. Cant say much as I was part of the team and its taken 10 years to get to this stage.. alot of priority software stuff going on..growing the sea weed in hidden bunkers deep beneath Tokyo.. obviously legally I cant give much away here.. but we are of course really excited with whats happening..I will give up dates when possible..

 

Un. Naruhodo.

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The fs7 like the new Venice .. has a special electronic "Tokyo Green" filter, that actually forms part of the sensor itself.. i

As a long time F55 user, I hope the original 'Osaka Green' will still be available as an option. i don't like it when a manufacturer restricts my color palette.

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Stuart.. I pressed hard to keep the legacy Osaka Green.. as a result it will be available as a $50,000 option.. the Sony heritage is based on the Osaka Green and I did incorporate some aspects into the new sensor.. cant give details obviously .. but rest assured I will bring up your concerns with the board..

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I'm not sure I got a straight answer, but is the FS7 really the new F55? I'm imagining someone googling this and finding this forum. Then, they'll think it's easier to get a usable image from a Sony than to get a legitimate answer to that question. ;-)

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No Samuel, the FS7 is not the new F55, but I assume you already knew that.

 

I'm grateful for the answer, but there's no need to be suspicious. I mean, how on Earth would I know that? If you ever read my posts you'll know that I know nothing, NOTHING. I know nothing, I see nothing, I didn't even get up this morning.

 

Is anyone willing to post the difference between the two?

Edited by Samuel Berger

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Stuart.. I pressed hard to keep the legacy Osaka Green.. as a result it will be available as a $50,000 option.. the Sony heritage is based on the Osaka Green and I did incorporate some aspects into the new sensor.. cant give details obviously .. but rest assured I will bring up your concerns with the board..

Thanks Robin, after all, how will people know it's digital if it's not green??

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Sam.. yes it is.. different sensor F55 is global shutter ,native 1250 ISO and color filter.. and different Raw.12 bit not 16 bit like f5/55..but the codec is the same.. actually fs7 has XAVC L (Long GOP and Prores (could be an option) I wasn't trying to wind you up.. I thought you were joking.. its a much cheaper camera but the highest selling "professional" video camera by a long way I would wager.. at the moment anyway.. there is a Fs7 mark II with a PL type mount (locks anti clockwise) and stronger mount, chassis .. also has an incredible electric variable ND.. Ive used it once and its really amazing.. build is a bit plastic and for TC in and V mount you need the extra "back" extension unit.. best bang for the buck of any camera around .. for the average corp or TV production not shot Raw,needing global shutter..alot of complex grading..TBH there is probably very little discernible difference .. if lenses are the same..

 

Stuart.. Yes to avoid the terrible artifacts seen in the old film camera,s.. together with some Sony engineers I trained up.. I have actually made up a special bespoke Digital Green DG #1 -10 set.. to set my work apart when shooting film..

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Thanks, Robin. Was trying to understand the price difference. It might be my tired old eyes but I couldn't really see any difference between them in footage.

 

I have a Mini 4K which I'm selling, I was going to replace it with a Mini Pro but then I saw stuff from the Canon C300 Mark II and wasn't sure any longer. As you well know, I really only like film but sometimes it's about getting a job. And I feel that learning about these can help me learn different perspectives in post-production as well.

 

At the moment I'm deciding between the Ursa Mini Pro and the C300 Mk2. The UMP is definitely less money and my 4K accessories transfer over, as well as my EF lenses from my BMPCC. It would probably make the most sense but the C300 Mk2 just blew me away. Is it used in episodic at all?

 

I think it's a good thing I didn't replace my 2 Eclair NPR packages with an Aaton XTR Prod. They are on the same level in terms of image quality if lenses are the same. But with video this isn't the case. I hate buying anything for video because it can take me six months to research and decide on a purchase, and then something new comes out and I have to start all over.

Edited by Samuel Berger

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I don't know if the C300 MKII is used on any episodic TV.. but its a pretty high level camera and certainly used for a lot of corp /doc /broadcast work ..and some features where they need to get into tight places.. I think its fair to say it would be seen as level up from the Mini pro and for sure a more "known" camera to producers and directors .. and really if your freelance this is huge issue.. buy the "wrong" camera for your market, how ever good it is.. and its a door stop.. ask anyone who bought a Pana Varicam LT for corp shoots.. its almost Sony Fs7/F5/55 or C300 II or nothing..

 

Personally due to using the C300 a few times years ago and just hating the design I have avoided them ever since.. but I know people with there C300 II that love it and it makes them a fortune.. and of course they are a very much accepted camera..

 

These days there is more of firmware up dates, than new models ..as it used to be at least..!..

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I'm grateful for the answer, but there's no need to be suspicious.

 

Is anyone willing to post the difference between the two?

 

The FS7 is a budget camera, in the same price bracket as the Ursa Mini Pro, and the Canon C300. The F55 is the top of line camera, about to be superseded/replaced by the Sony Venice.

 

I've used both, sometimes together, on various shows. The FS7 is a great little camera, although it needs to be properly accessorized for professional use. The pictures are lovely. Good dynamic range and color. Some people don't like Sony color, but that's hardly an issue any more with Log recording.

 

The F55 has all the same features and codecs, but in a bigger, better made body. It also has a different sensor, color filter array, and color science. The FS7 looks good, but compared to the F55 it is lacking. You can team the FS7 and F5 up together as A and B cameras with no problems, but with the F55 you can see a difference. Its colors are more natural looking, and it has slightly more dynamic range, due to its lower native ISO.

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