Oppenheimer (21st July 2023) Christoper Nolan / Hoyte Van Hoytema

[Jeff Bernstein]

Tyler Purcell : "I wish Nolan cared more about the content rather than the format and style. It comes off as very self indulgent."

 

Friend, you're on the wrong side of history, yet you keep talking.

 

Oppenheimer : $400,000,000 and counting.

[Tyler Purcell]

10 hours ago, Jeff Bernstein said:

Friend, you're on the wrong side of history, yet you keep talking.

 

Oppenheimer : $400,000,000 and counting.

What does box-office have to do with anything? 

The studios spent 200M easily on marketing alone. 

[Scott Pickering]

I know they are out there, but is 8k laser projection possible today? Could they do like IMAX and put two 4K projectors together to make 8k rez?

Edited August 3, 2023 by Scott Pickering

[Tyler Purcell]

3 hours ago, Scott Pickering said:

I know they are out there, but is 8k laser projection possible today? Could they do like IMAX and put two 4K projectors together to make 8k rez?

No, there is no 8k system. You're right, two 4k projectors could work, but there is no playout server. 

[Scott Pickering]

Tyler. Was there not a demo by NHK some years back in a theater showing some sports event? One person said it was like looking into a window. Also Samsung is supposed to be coming out with a short throw 8k projector.

[Tyler Purcell]

1 hour ago, Scott Pickering said:

Tyler. Was there not a demo by NHK some years back in a theater showing some sports event? One person said it was like looking into a window. Also Samsung is supposed to be coming out with a short throw 8k projector.

Yea, I saw that demo. But no real play out solution has been designed yet. It seems odd when it's so easy to stitch together 2x4k projectors today. 

[Scott Pickering]

Well I saw Oppenheimer in IMAX 70mm again today. Seeing the movie a second time flowed better and made more sense this time. You obviously miss a lot on first viewing. I also noticed a lot of out of focus shots in this film. Im really starting to think IMAX print is closer to 8K in rez seen. It looked sharp, but not digital sharp. It still had that soft film look, but with more detail. Grain was noticable on many of the shots. Of course 15 perf worked the best for everything. It produced the cleanest image of all of it. I liked the film more the second time. It certainly ranks as one of Nolans best work.

[Gregory Irwin]

I saw the 70mm format of the picture last night at a flagship cinema in Atlanta, GA.  Overall, I enjoyed the movie. I enjoyed the history of Oppenheimer and the impactful figures who affected his life.  I enjoyed the performances - especially Downey.  However, I think (and I’m going to get skewered for saying this) Nolan is getting more self indulgent with his filmmaking style.  He has to prove over and over how smart he is as opposed to letting the story say it.  HE IS SMART!  He’s the smartest guy in the room but he doesn’t need to show us all of the time by trying to be clever.  I feel that he tries too hard at times to be clever.  Unlike Todd Phillips, who can weave a multi layered story to fit together when you can’t imagine how it will all fit till it’s done, Chris seems to only create confusion. Having said this he did do a very good job with the very complicated INTERSTELLAR.  I am very qualified to say this since I’ve worked with both.  Five movies with Todd and one with Chris. OPPENHEIMER was confusing and I already knew the story since I’m a huge history buff. But I did enjoy it overall.

As for the cinematography, I’m sick and tired of watching uber shallow images that are crushed into the foot of the exposure curve.  I want to see more of the grand format the Chris chooses for his movies!  Shallow and dark doesn’t always do it for me.  Scott made an observation in the above post about soft focus.  Let me tell you from experience that there isn’t more difficult focus pulling than a Nolan picture.  My experience with him was the most challenging focus pulling in my career.  It’s not about keeping every shot sharp but rather maintaining the damage control with the inevitable focus buzz that’s bound to happen!  It’s because of the cinematic style that Chris chooses to employ and he, above everyone else understands how difficult he makes it and he accepts the  occasional soft focus.  I applaud Keith Davis’s work.  He was simply miraculous!  Hoyte doesn’t give him (or me) any feedback regarding focus even though he’s looking through the eyepiece.  It’s like flying a jumbo jet in the clouds without any radar!  Keith was on his own, flying blind.  Great work!  I don’t know if it was the theater I was in or if anyone else experienced this but the music track was drowning out the dialogue at times.  Did anyone else notice this?  Anyway, there’s my review.  Let the skewering begin!

G

[Eric Eader]

Greg,

I agree with you on darkness levels being so low as to render an image invisible, and the music track being so loud that it drowns out dialogue.  This happens on too many movies today.  

On the image side I think we are so far away from the Black and White days of moviemaking that separation of planes is a lost or receding art and subtle but effective illumination of objects within a darkened environment is virtually (pun intended) lost also.

That can also be experienced within the pages of American Cinematographer magazine where images disappear into darkness quite frequently.

Theatricality and reality must co-exist.  With theatricality perhaps receiving slightly more weight in both image and aural space.

A disclaimer:  my hearing is not the best,  helicopters and guns, have taken their toll;  but still, today's dialogue is sometimes spoken so softly that it is inaudible even without a music track, which, when it is there, makes it doubly hard to hear. Again, I submit, theatricality must win over reality....  just by a little bit!

Covid has killed local cinema viewing here in Daytona Beach,  (last movie I saw on a big screen was either Ford vs. Ferrari, or 1917), but at least I can activate closed captioning when DVD'ing or streaming....  but that distracts from the visual experience.

So, I look forward to seeing Oppenheimer streamed or on DVD soon.

[Scott Pickering]

Greg. I agree on the difficulty focus pulling IMAX film cameras. I use 6x7 film format myself with a Pentax, and I did a shoot 2 weeks ago, where I missed focus on most shots at f2.4. So I can understand where you are coming from. 

Maybe Im a simple guy, but can you elaborate with examples on how Nolan has become self indulgent or too clever? Im not seeing what you are alluding to. But then again I notice more technical stuff then story process, etc.

I'll note while I was in the Oppenheimer show a second time, the people I sat next to told me about a technical issue at the Langley theater that stopped a show last week. So my theater wasn't immune to these issues either.

Its been commented who will still use film or make film prints when directors like Nolan retire? They say we may only have 20 years left with film. I also heard IMAX is considering putting back more 15/70 projectors in IMAX theaters around the world, due to demand.

Edited August 7, 2023 by Scott Pickering

[Gautam Valluri]

10 hours ago, Gregory Irwin said:

Nolan is getting more self indulgent with his filmmaking style.  He has to prove over and over how smart he is as opposed to letting the story say it.  HE IS SMART!  He’s the smartest guy in the room but he doesn’t need to show us all of the time by trying to be clever.

You hit the nail on the head. His fans justify his incoherent filmmaking by attributing it to intelligence. Sure it's always impressive when a filmmaker is able to convey a lot by saying very little but this is not the case with Nolan.

His films since The Dark Knight Rises have really fallen off into a 2.5-hour assembly of shots. There are no more "scenes" in his films. We cut and jump around in space and time without any indication as to where or when in the story we are. After a while, it gets irritating.

It seems like a waste of 5/70mm and 15/70mm images if we don't get to inhabit the landscapes of these films like we did in the deserts of Lawrence of Arabia or have some of the best talent in the industry but not let them unfurl their performances in a proper mise-en-scène.

Also his final act reveals have become weak and predictable:

Oppenheimer - "it was Strauss all along but wait, Oppie managed to make sure his legacy is intact..."

Tenet - "I am the protagonist! You were working for me all along."

Dunkirk - "Local kid dies a hero in Dunkirk...(having been an unfortunate victim of an accident)"

Interstellar- "I told you I'll come back..." (okay this gets a pass for the emotional weight)

The Dark Knight Rises- "It wasn't him who climbed out of the pit, it was. And also I'm the daughter of Ra's Al-Ghul"

Bonus: How awkward were the gratuitous sex scenes in Oppenheimer? It felt like Nolan was trying to go full Nic Roeg but just ended up with some super cringy stuff.

[Ole Alstrup]

Oppenheimer in DUAL 70MM projection at ROYAL BIO - Malmö, Sweden

Hi Everyone, 

I just shot this video in Sweden on Saturday, wanted to share with you here. ?70MM?

Edited August 7, 2023 by Ole Alstrup
Typo

[Stephen Perera]

........and yet here we all are saying how great Kubrick's 2001: A Space Odyssey is...I for one haven't got a clue what the hell that was all about and just appreciate the film as a visual experience.....especially the space travel Pan Am flight with the stewardesses and all the tech......

Great contribution from our man Gregory Irwin in this thread thanks for that....you are truly entitled to criticise and say whatever you want about this subject indeed!

All that being said.....Long live film! Long live Nolan! hahahaha

Edited August 7, 2023 by Stephen Perera

[Ignacio Aguilar]

I can't say that I've enjoyed too much the IMAX digital presentation of OPPENHEIMER in Madrid, Spain (no real 70mm IMAX or 5-perf 70mm around). I really missed the blacks of true 70mm projection, here they were were poor even in some day interior scenes, so I don't think it's a exposure related problem. 

[Kemalettin Sert]

On 8/6/2023 at 3:26 PM, Gregory Irwin said:

 I don’t know if it was the theater I was in or if anyone else experienced this but the music track was drowning out the dialogue at times.  Did anyone else notice this?  Anyway, there’s my review.  Let the skewering begin!

G

https://collider.com/oppenheimer-dialogue-christopher-nolan-comments/

Looks like it was an artistic choice.

 

[Robin Phillips]

I'll be honest, Im kinda baffled by folks who think the movie was self indulgent and not a compelling story. I thought it was engrossing and moved along at a somewhat amazing clip for a 3 hour picture. But as they say in the legal profession, reasonable minds can disagree. 

Of relevance to the projection, I just saw it yesterday morning at the theater in Dublin CA in 15/70, and for the life of me I have no idea why this random theater near Livermore has a 15/70 setup, but I was very surprised by how clean the print still was and how good the projection was. Very glad I managed to see it in this format, given the disastrous projection of the 70mm 5 perf Interstellar print I saw back when it came out (I'd basically written off film projection entirely as a result). Interestingly I didnt pick up on any of the green tint concerns with the B&W with this print. I wonder if there are variances in either the prints of the wavelength reproduction of some of the bulbs that caused that for some folks.

I'll also say, it was a lot of fun seeing cloud tank work done in this format. Some good details on the guys that actually did the VFX in the recent before and afters article if anyone is interested https://beforesandafters.com/2023/08/17/spinning-beads-cloud-tanks-and-crucibles-of-molten-thermite

[Tyler Purcell]

1 hour ago, Robin Phillips said:

Interestingly I didnt pick up on any of the green tint concerns with the B&W with this print. I wonder if there are variances in either the prints of the wavelength reproduction of some of the bulbs that caused that for some folks.

 

Yea inconsistencies with the process will alter the tint just slightly. Ours was very green. I think some peoples vision varies of course and slight differences in color, effect some people, but not others. I know what B&W is supposed to look like and many people don't have that "instant" reference in their mind ya know? 

[John Shell]

On 7/31/2023 at 6:04 AM, Kemalettin Sert said:

There s no chance 65mm 15perf resolves 18K details.Technically impossible i would say.

50MP Venice 2 is almost 2 times sharper than 65mm Vision negative which was shot on medium format camera and used same pentax lenses on both cameras.

It would be fair comparing 4x5 film against todays digital cameras.I shoot 4x5 a lot 100 ISO mostly and they are not even sharper than my GFX 100s.

Any chance you could share some of the images you've shot. and compared??.

[Robin Phillips]

4 hours ago, John Shell said:

Any chance you could share some of the images you've shot. and compared??.

I'd also be interested to see a test where we actually took lenses of comparable sharpness to say master primes but that could cover the 15/70 area (I dont think such lenses exist). would be very interesting to see what the line pair resolution is compared to a digital body (ideally with any internal sharpening turned off so its actually a reasonable test). 

Unfortunately this is probably a cost prohibitive test

[Harold Buchman]

I finally got to a 15/70 presentation of Oppenheimer at the Regal Cinemas Irvine Spectrum.

I had the best seat in the house.  As the projector spun up I knew I was in for a cinematic experience I had not had since 2001 (The year, not the film)

The presentation was excellent. bright, rock steady, zero scratches, only the occasional bit of dust. If this is indeed the print they've been running since July, it's amazing how well it has held up. Much credit must go to Kodak, PhotoKem, Imax, and Regal.

I was hoping for Lawrence Of Arabia with nuclear physics.

I didn't get either.

However, I do hope the commercial success of Oppenheimer will make big film presentation available to movie makers with vision to match the grandeur and richness of the format.