Premium Member Aapo Lettinen Posted June 3, 2016 Premium Member Share Posted June 3, 2016 This one is in the same category as Alexa 65? at least it is aimed to be. We well see how it works out but I think Panavision has kept the standards pretty high as usual ^_^ about the RED sensor VS Arri sensor, I think one can just treat them like different film stocks, like Fuji vs. Kodak. that is quite good analogy actually because the Red sensors have traditionally had more crosstalk and harsher highlight handling and because most of the people seem to prefer the "Kodak look" of the Alexa because of the colour reproduction difference and more pleasant "grain" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexandros Angelopoulos Apostolos Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 So could you tell me if the sensor sizes are: 1. ALEXA 65 – 54.12 mm × 25.58 mm 2. RED WEAPON DRAGON – 40.96 mm × 21.6 mm 2. Panavision Millenium DXL – 40.96 mm × 21.6 mm 3. Sony F65 CineAlta – 24.7 mm × 13.1 mm what is the criterion for putting all these cameras in the same class? And two, considering what you said above (Fuji vs. Kodak), why was The Hobbit then shot on the RED EPIC camera? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Drysdale Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 (edited) "The Hobbit" was shot in 3D, on which they used a 2 camera rig. That's a more difficult arrangement with film cameras. 8K sensors, rather than the sensor size: The F65 has a 1.9:1 aspect ratio Super 35 width sensors, while the RED/Panavision is more Vistavision compared to the 65mm sized Arri. Edited June 3, 2016 by Brian Drysdale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Aapo Lettinen Posted June 3, 2016 Premium Member Share Posted June 3, 2016 So could you tell me if the sensor sizes are: 1. ALEXA 65 – 54.12 mm × 25.58 mm 2. RED WEAPON DRAGON – 40.96 mm × 21.6 mm 2. Panavision Millenium DXL – 40.96 mm × 21.6 mm 3. Sony F65 CineAlta – 24.7 mm × 13.1 mm what is the criterion for putting all these cameras in the same class? And two, considering what you said above (Fuji vs. Kodak), why was The Hobbit then shot on the RED EPIC camera? I would not put the F65 to the same class, it is a more traditional digital cinema camera with more practical sensor size than those oddball ones. With a cinema camera you are always a bit screwed if you can't use all the lenses you would like to, thus it is usually better to stay on the closest standard rather than trying to make a new one. this is especially true with lens mounts. As far as I know The Hobbit was shot on Epic because of the 3D rigs, large amount of cameras used and because Peter Jackson was/is a supporter of RED so he could have great service and pre release models for the shoot. I think it was a good choice considering the production as a whole. however I was very disappointed with the colour rendition in 3D hfr release, I watched the last 2 movies in 2D because it is just so disappointing to watch a fantasy film without colours :blink: it was not theather's fault as far as I know and definitely not camera's fault (the 2D versions were fine as well as the 3D version without the glasses on) so maybe the 3D was not a perfect choice in this series I think :ph34r: 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin R Probyn Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Maybe because the F65 .. although a smaller size sensor.. the pixel,s are set in a clever way (diagonal grid).. that its a 6K sensor.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Drysdale Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 A few details from Michael Cioni from Light Iron. https://www.cinema5d.com/first-look-at-the-panavision-millenium-dxl-with-light-iron-ceo-michael-cioni-at-cine-gear-2016/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted June 6, 2016 Premium Member Share Posted June 6, 2016 Anything less than that wouldn't be up to the traditional Panavision standard, their film cameras went toe to toe with Arri. Er, an awful lot of them were Arri cameras. Panavision were Arri's biggest customer. Probably still are..... Panavision were never proud; if enough people asked for something, they'd get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Drysdale Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 True, they Panavised a lot of Arris. I was thinking more of the Panaflex v the Arri 35 BL cameras, which was a sort of Apple v PC thing at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Igor Trajkovski Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 What's the thinking behind the sensor size? Neither VistaVision nor 65mm.... New lenses on the way optimized for this format? Another entry in Field of View calculators? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Drysdale Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Here's an article which may explain. http://www.fdtimes.com/2015/04/27/regarding-red-20x40/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Satsuki Murashige Posted June 7, 2016 Premium Member Share Posted June 7, 2016 What's the thinking behind the sensor size? I would guess full height (4perf) anamorphic with look-around for all the classic PV scope lenses would be of primary importance. Next would be making use of the 65mm glass from Vantage and PV, Hawk65 and Primo70. Plus all the classic 65mm glass from PV. Lastly, more resolution for visual effects and large format presentation. But I think it's mostly about making better use of the existing lenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Drysdale Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 (edited) Light Iron's Michael Cioni on the Panavision DXL http://www.redsharknews.com/production/item/3554-inside-the-panavision-dxl-%E2%80%9Cthe-most-advanced-digital-cinema-camera-ever-made%E2%80%9D Edited June 14, 2016 by Brian Drysdale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Drysdale Posted June 15, 2016 Share Posted June 15, 2016 An Art Adams article on the DXL http://www.provideocoalition.com/panavision-millenium-dxl-light-iron-red-create-winning-new-look-large-format-cinematography/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Drysdale Posted July 14, 2016 Share Posted July 14, 2016 An Adam Wilt article on the DXL http://www.dvinfo.net/article/acquisition/thoughts-on-the-panavision-millenium-dxl.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted December 31, 2017 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2017 So 18 months on, what has been shot with this? Is there any website that carries that sort of information, apart from the manufacturers' websites? If there's a place for that on the Panavision site, I can't find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Gregory Irwin Posted December 31, 2017 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2017 We tested the DXL extensively for GODZILLA 2017. We didnt care for the RED sensor for the same reasons we dont like the RED cameras. We opted for the Alexa 65 and were very satisfied with the results. G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Phil Rhodes Posted December 31, 2017 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2017 reasons we dont like the RED cameras I'm sure I'm not the only person who would be interested to hear your comments on that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted December 31, 2017 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2017 When I was finishing "The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel" in NYC in early September, my operator was about to start a pilot shoot with a DXL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Dom Jaeger Posted December 31, 2017 Premium Member Share Posted December 31, 2017 Some productions listed here: http://www.panavision.com/cinematographer-experiences-shooting-panavision-millennium-dxl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted January 3, 2018 Premium Member Share Posted January 3, 2018 Roll crickets..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 3, 2018 Premium Member Share Posted January 3, 2018 What do you mean? That link that Dom gave you listed three features plus a pilot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted January 3, 2018 Premium Member Share Posted January 3, 2018 In 18 months....? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuel Berger Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 In 18 months....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member David Mullen ASC Posted January 3, 2018 Premium Member Share Posted January 3, 2018 There hasn't been a full inventory of DXL's completely finished for 18 months. I think it's been 18 months since they introduced it as a prototype with some test footage at Cinegear, then 12 months ago they were showing off the new color science to go with the camera, or maybe it was only 9 months ago. A few features, pilots, and commercials so far seem to me to be right, especially for a somewhat specialized camera -- shooting features on full-frame 35mm sensor cameras is a fairly new thing. Plus the truth is that a lot of people are very happy with the quality and look from the regular Alexa cameras, so there isn't a lot of incentive to switch unless you are required to shoot with a +4K camera. You made similar posts about the Genesis camera when it came out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member Keith Walters Posted January 3, 2018 Premium Member Share Posted January 3, 2018 You made similar posts about the Genesis camera when it came out. :blink: When was that? I don't recall making any posts about the Genesis when it came out. Was this forum even running then? "Plus the truth is that a lot of people are very happy with the quality and look from the regular Alexa cameras, so there isn't a lot of incentive to switch unless you are required to shoot with a +4K camera." Just so, and apart from which, if you desperately have to have a Red camera, Panavision will quite happily rent you one, or an Alexa for that matter. Plus Arri have had 4K prototypes for a long time, but they checked out the market first before going at it like a bull at a gate. This is just another white effluent from a company that hasn't made an operating profit in nearly 5 decades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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